How did Jesus refer to God
ShepherdsDog @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:10 pm
There seems to be a lot of willful stupidity and ignorance out there when it comes to how God is named. Some stupid people out there claim that Allah and YWH are not one and the same. Well, Jews, Christians and Muslims in the Arab world all referred to God as Allah...there was no other word. An even more interesting fact is that Jesus, who spoke Aramaic referred to God as Alaha or Elaha.
Observant Jews don't refer to God as Yahweh, hut only use the Hebrew characters that translate as YHWH, as it didnt use vowels.They also avoided saying it, I case it was mispronounced and the second commandment was violated.
There is also the entire linguistic argument that points back to the common roots of Arabic and Hebrewe. El and Al are one and the same, just as Odin and Woden were the same god to the ancient Norse and Germanic tribes.
Coach85 @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:36 pm
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
There seems to be a lot of willful stupidity and ignorance out there when it comes to how God is named. Some stupid people out there claim that Allah and YWH are not one and the same. Well, Jews, Christians and Muslims in the Arab world all referred to God as Allah...there was no other word. An even more interesting fact is that Jesus, who spoke Aramaic referred to God as Alaha or Elaha.
Observant Jews don't refer to God as Yahweh, hut only use the Hebrew characters that translate as YHWH, as it didnt use vowels.They also avoided saying it, I case it was mispronounced and the second commandment was violated.
There is also the entire linguistic argument that points back to the common roots of Arabic and Hebrewe. El and Al are one and the same, just as Odin and Woden were the same god to the ancient Norse and Germanic tribes.
Observant Jews don't refer to God as Yahweh, hut only use the Hebrew characters that translate as YHWH, as it didnt use vowels.They also avoided saying it, I case it was mispronounced and the second commandment was violated.
There is also the entire linguistic argument that points back to the common roots of Arabic and Hebrewe. El and Al are one and the same, just as Odin and Woden were the same god to the ancient Norse and Germanic tribes.
Either way, who cares? It's a mythical being that exists only in the minds of believers.
ShepherdsDog @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:52 pm
Yet millions have died over how this mythical being's name is pronounced or on which day its followers prayed to it.
Tricks @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:06 pm
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
Yet millions have died over how this mythical being's name is pronounced or on which day its followers prayed to it.
Sounds like wide scale darwinism to me.
Coach85 @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:10 pm
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
Yet millions have died over how this mythical being's name is pronounced or on which day its followers prayed to it.
And yet, people are still concerned?
How many more millions need to die before people just step back and say, " does any of this matter?"
BartSimpson @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:29 pm
Tricks Tricks:
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
Yet millions have died over how this mythical being's name is pronounced or on which day its followers prayed to it.
Sounds like wide scale darwinism to me.
I suspect that the really wide scale Darwinism is yet to come.
Tricks @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:19 pm
BartSimpson BartSimpson:
Tricks Tricks:
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
Yet millions have died over how this mythical being's name is pronounced or on which day its followers prayed to it.
Sounds like wide scale darwinism to me.
I suspect that the really wide scale Darwinism is yet to come.
It's not the North Korean's faults they're brainwashed.
BeaverFever @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:54 pm
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
There seems to be a lot of willful stupidity and ignorance out there when it comes to how God is named. Some stupid people out there claim that Allah and YWH are not one and the same. Well, Jews, Christians and Muslims in the Arab world all referred to God as Allah...there was no other word. An even more interesting fact is that Jesus, who spoke Aramaic referred to God as Alaha or Elaha.
Observant Jews don't refer to God as Yahweh, hut only use the Hebrew characters that translate as YHWH, as it didnt use vowels.They also avoided saying it, I case it was mispronounced and the second commandment was violated.
There is also the entire linguistic argument that points back to the common roots of Arabic and Hebrewe. El and Al are one and the same, just as Odin and Woden were the same god to the ancient Norse and Germanic tribes.
Observant Jews don't refer to God as Yahweh, hut only use the Hebrew characters that translate as YHWH, as it didnt use vowels.They also avoided saying it, I case it was mispronounced and the second commandment was violated.
There is also the entire linguistic argument that points back to the common roots of Arabic and Hebrewe. El and Al are one and the same, just as Odin and Woden were the same god to the ancient Norse and Germanic tribes.
El was also the name and/or tittle of various pre-judaism Bronze Age pagan deities in the levant and Near Middle East and was also a generic word used by polytheists as a common noun to refer to any god. El was the name of the supreme god of the Canaanites.
IIRC, El and YHWH were actually at one point two completely different deities, possibly worshipped by two completely different populations, until someone decided to try and join the two religions together, probably some ambitious priest trying to spread his influence
BartSimpson @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:01 pm
Tricks Tricks:
It's not the North Korean's faults they're brainwashed.
You know, I've long wondered why brainwashing doesn't involve some old Irish lady pulling a brain out of someone's noggin and then running it up and down a wash board until it's clean.
That's always the image I have of brainwashing.
And if it really worked this way then I'd totally understand why the North Koreans are so fucked up.
N_Fiddledog @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:26 pm
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
There seems to be a lot of willful stupidity and ignorance out there when it comes to how God is named. Some stupid people out there claim that Allah and YWH are not one and the same. Well, Jews, Christians and Muslims in the Arab world all referred to God as Allah...there was no other word. An even more interesting fact is that Jesus, who spoke Aramaic referred to God as Alaha or Elaha.
Observant Jews don't refer to God as Yahweh, hut only use the Hebrew characters that translate as YHWH, as it didnt use vowels.They also avoided saying it, I case it was mispronounced and the second commandment was violated.
There is also the entire linguistic argument that points back to the common roots of Arabic and Hebrewe. El and Al are one and the same, just as Odin and Woden were the same god to the ancient Norse and Germanic tribes.
Observant Jews don't refer to God as Yahweh, hut only use the Hebrew characters that translate as YHWH, as it didnt use vowels.They also avoided saying it, I case it was mispronounced and the second commandment was violated.
There is also the entire linguistic argument that points back to the common roots of Arabic and Hebrewe. El and Al are one and the same, just as Odin and Woden were the same god to the ancient Norse and Germanic tribes.
I was shocked - shocked I tell you - to learn there are those who dare to disagree.
For example, this one's from a Christian College:
Is Allah of Islam the same as Yahweh of Christianity?
But Christians, phhhht...what do they know, right?
Now as to the etymology of the words, I checked it out and it looks more complex than what you describe,
http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Yahweh
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yahweh
https://www.britannica.com/search?query=allah
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Allah
but there's 2 ways to K.I.S.S (keep it simple stupid.)
There's your way, were little fractured factoids are separated from the nuance to support a simple broad-based command of what must be considered as the only true truth...so to speak.
There's another way where in the interest of ease of understanding the totality is bundled as a suggested to be superior general truth.
I'll give you an example of that. You'll have to forgive them, because they're Christians:
$1:
Last remark: The arabic word Allah, used also by Arabic Christians, is no more no less related to the Aramaic Alaha than to the Hebrew Elohim. The three share a common linguistic root, which is nothing exceptional, so no point being dragged on sterile arguments concerning this point.
https://christianity.stackexchange.com/ ... in-aramaic
So yeah, there's a common linguistic root to the name. There's even other borrowed names and tropes in the Koran from the Bible, but does that mean the God of the Koran is the same character as the God they're talking about in the Bible. Not so much. They differ fundamentally.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwxuY9uaNyc
N_Fiddledog @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:33 pm
This is kind of fascinating though:
$1:
ShepherdsDog wrote:
Yet millions have died over how this mythical being's name is pronounced or on which day its followers prayed to it.
Yet millions have died over how this mythical being's name is pronounced or on which day its followers prayed to it.
I'm not sure I understand what you're talking about. Millions died over the pronunciation of the word, you say?
![[huh]](./images/smilies/icon_scratch.gif "huh?"){kind=icon}
Got an example?
BeaverFever @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:34 pm
El, Yaweh, Allah....all different versions of the same fictional character.
Sean Connory, Roger Moore, Pierce Brosnan, Daniel Craig, all very played different versions of James Bond. But they were all playing the same fictional character.
N_Fiddledog @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:45 pm
The analogy I almost used was Marvel's Thor versus the Thor of Norse Mythology. Same guy?
The point where such comparisons become ineffectual though is what Shep nodded towards. Not so much pronunciation of the names, but people will go to war over the fundamentals of the beliefs in different religions. Sometimes just the fact that "the other' hold them.
Then again...I'll bet there have been a few nerd slap-fights over 'Best Bond? Moore or Connery?'
BartSimpson @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:45 pm
BeaverFever BeaverFever:
Sean Connory, Roger Moore, Pierce Brosnan, Daniel Craig, all very played different versions of James Bond. But they were all playing the same fictional character.
Uh-huh. And Cesar Romero and Heath Ledger played the same fictional character, too.
No difference and no big deal.
N_Fiddledog @ Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:08 pm
Ever heard the one about what "Allahu Akbar" actually means?
"God is greater."
Greater than what, would be the obvious question.
Pamela Geller suggests "Allahu Akbar" as in "God is greater" really means, "Greater than your God." (Yes I know. Command from the Prog mothership is we must hate Pamela Geller. Don't care. I'll listen until she stops making sense.)