Does Canada deserve a better political system?
koizumi @ Wed Jul 16, 2008 7:32 pm
I look at all the major parties we have and I feel ashamed at the lack of good choices we have in this country.
1. Liberal Party: too arrogant and thinks that Canadians owe them votes (look at how many times they've been elected).
2. Conservative Party (abandoned traditional Canadian Conservatism for American Conservatism, starting to show some arrogance).
3. NDP Far too left wing, accuses the private markets for everything, no real plans. Sorry but this isn't western Europe.
4. Bloc: Don't get me started.
Benoit @ Wed Jul 16, 2008 8:19 pm
When Canadians will admit how lucky they are for being surrounded by natural resources, they will be able to adopt the most perfect and contagious political system: a deliberative democracy.
improve-canada-f19/create-a-new-federal-political-party-t30777.html
ridenrain @ Wed Jul 16, 2008 8:46 pm
koizumi: Are you even Canadian?
They say that in politics, you don't need to be a 10 if all the others are 3. We get the government we deserve and our apathy dosen't make it better.
Benoit @ Wed Jul 16, 2008 9:02 pm
ridenrain ridenrain:
koizumi: Are you even Canadian?
They say that in politics, you don't need to be a 10 if all the others are 3. We get the government we deserve and our apathy dosen't make it better.
They say that in politics, you don't need to be a 10 if all the others are 3. We get the government we deserve and our apathy dosen't make it better.
When a political party violates electoral rules, a population doesn't get the government it deserves. When a political party violates electoral rules, we don't speak of apathy but of despair.
sandorski @ Wed Jul 16, 2008 10:18 pm
Our Political system is one of the best in the World. No political Party will ever be an exact match with any Voter, so expecting some kind of perfect match is foolishness.
So far Canadians have voiced their displeasure with both the Conc and Libs by forcing them into Minority Governments. I suspect the next Government will also be a Minority, which will force the Cons/Libs to both change their Leaders.
herbie @ Wed Jul 16, 2008 10:58 pm
The Tories don't need to change their leader, they need to change some MPs. Whenever some dinosaur speaks up about traditions and Christian values you can see the Fraser Valley CPC MPs wince and shake their turbans.... thousands of votes that Kim Campbell could have delivered squandered away by the homophobes, every ageing lifetime Tory who's son/daughter comes out of the closet (click! That's MY kid they don't want to see maried) pissed away.
My own vote's been up for grabs the last 3 times. NDP, NDP, and NDP. At least the Christian Heritage candidate here stated and stood by his values, he didn't sit there and smirk, refuse to answer anything controversial, and cop the attitude he deserved our vote because he wasn't a Liberal!
Thanos @ Wed Jul 16, 2008 11:19 pm
$1:
2. Conservative Party (abandoned traditional Canadian Conservatism for American Conservatism, starting to show some arrogance).
I dispute this point. There's no real evidence whatsoever to suggest that the current Conservatives are all that close to the hard Right of American Conservatism. The Harper Tories are dead silent on abortion and more or less diffused any controversy over gay marriage with a "no big deal" attitude about it. Contrast these two issues to the American Right, which has fighting over abortion/gays as the very reason for it's existence.
If anything Canadian Conservatives are closer to the moderate Republicans/conservative Democrats of the United States, and both of these groups are universally appalled by the crazed theoconservatism that's ruined the Republican party, and they're goping to vote for Barack Obama in a landslide. If anything, once Obama finds out which part of the spectrum the Harper Conservatives occupy he'll feel right at home with Canadian Conservatives.
Saying that the Harper Conservatives are neo-cons is really just an empty and ridiculous sound-bite invented by Canadian Liberals, who are so bereft of any new ideas of their own and who are plagued by an undeniably inept and pathetic leadership that they can now only resort to drive-by smears just to get some attention.
warwickgreen @ Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:08 am
Let's implement PR. Perpetual minorities ( to keep the government on its toes) as well as the House spiced up with some Greens, CHPers, Alberta separatists etc. 
mtbr @ Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:35 am
Thanos Thanos:
$1:
2. Conservative Party (abandoned traditional Canadian Conservatism for American Conservatism, starting to show some arrogance).
I dispute this point. There's no real evidence whatsoever to suggest that the current Conservatives are all that close to the hard Right of American Conservatism. The Harper Tories are dead silent on abortion and more or less diffused any controversy over gay marriage with a "no big deal" attitude about it. Contrast these two issues to the American Right, which has fighting over abortion/gays as the very reason for it's existence.
If anything Canadian Conservatives are closer to the moderate Republicans/conservative Democrats of the United States, and both of these groups are universally appalled by the crazed theoconservatism that's ruined the Republican party, and they're goping to vote for Barack Obama in a landslide. If anything, once Obama finds out which part of the spectrum the Harper Conservatives occupy he'll feel right at home with Canadian Conservatives.
Saying that the Harper Conservatives are neo-cons is really just an empty and ridiculous sound-bite invented by Canadian Liberals, who are so bereft of any new ideas of their own and who are plagued by an undeniably inept and pathetic leadership that they can now only resort to drive-by smears just to get some attention.
I agree Canadian conservatism has nothing to compare with American conservatism. That type of comment is just a cheap shot from the Liberals in this country.
Mustang1 @ Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:06 am
mtbr mtbr:
Thanos Thanos:
$1:
2. Conservative Party (abandoned traditional Canadian Conservatism for American Conservatism, starting to show some arrogance).
I dispute this point. There's no real evidence whatsoever to suggest that the current Conservatives are all that close to the hard Right of American Conservatism. The Harper Tories are dead silent on abortion and more or less diffused any controversy over gay marriage with a "no big deal" attitude about it. Contrast these two issues to the American Right, which has fighting over abortion/gays as the very reason for it's existence.
If anything Canadian Conservatives are closer to the moderate Republicans/conservative Democrats of the United States, and both of these groups are universally appalled by the crazed theoconservatism that's ruined the Republican party, and they're goping to vote for Barack Obama in a landslide. If anything, once Obama finds out which part of the spectrum the Harper Conservatives occupy he'll feel right at home with Canadian Conservatives.
Saying that the Harper Conservatives are neo-cons is really just an empty and ridiculous sound-bite invented by Canadian Liberals, who are so bereft of any new ideas of their own and who are plagued by an undeniably inept and pathetic leadership that they can now only resort to drive-by smears just to get some attention.
I agree Canadian conservatism has nothing to compare with American conservatism. That type of comment is just a cheap shot from the Liberals in this country.
Really? "NOTHING"?!?!? Uh-oh...methinks someone is wading into the deep end of the pool...
Aspects of Canadian Conservatism don't hold the hardcore theocratic elements of American neoconservative (which isn't really an ideological tenat of neocan insomuch as it's an American phenomenon - some now even label it theoconservatism) BUT Straussian elements - especially manifested in the Calgary school - are shared components (of course, so are others).
In fact, Red Torys - the real moderate conservatives - have mostly migrated to the Liberal Party's platform due in large part to initial quasi-theocon social (and this is not to say all CPC espouse these doctrines) policies
If you're going to cheerlead - at least add something.
Public_Domain @ Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:10 am
DerbyX @ Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:11 am
Not to mention that once again the Liberals were blamed despite the fact that the comment came from somebody who was chastizing the Liberals just as much.
Mustang1 @ Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:14 am
koizumi koizumi:
I look at all the major parties we have and I feel ashamed at the lack of good choices we have in this country.
1. Liberal Party: too arrogant and thinks that Canadians owe them votes (look at how many times they've been elected).
2. Conservative Party (abandoned traditional Canadian Conservatism for American Conservatism, starting to show some arrogance).
3. NDP Far too left wing, accuses the private markets for everything, no real plans. Sorry but this isn't western Europe.
4. Bloc: Don't get me started.
1. Liberal Party: too arrogant and thinks that Canadians owe them votes (look at how many times they've been elected).
2. Conservative Party (abandoned traditional Canadian Conservatism for American Conservatism, starting to show some arrogance).
3. NDP Far too left wing, accuses the private markets for everything, no real plans. Sorry but this isn't western Europe.
4. Bloc: Don't get me started.
I think you might mean "party" not "system". The system, as it currently exists, is fine, but it seems you don't like the ideological choices represented by the cadre parties. That's fine, but in reality, too many choices can also present problems - splintering, coalitions, gridlock, constant non-confidence votes, frequent elections.
I do agree that the "Red" element is somewhat missing from the current incarnation of the Conservatives, but it isn't pushing theocon elements anymore which has led many political pundits to suggest that electoral victories have the best moderating effect on party policy.
Oh...and the NDP is far more moderate than European democratic socialists.
Benoit @ Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:38 am
Mustang1 Mustang1:
The system, as it currently exists, is fine, but it seems you don't like the ideological choices represented by the cadre parties.
Our political system like our justice system is agonistic: orientations are found after parties have made efforts to discredit other parties. It is easy to imagine a political system more conducive to agreements enthusiastically engaging all parties.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agonism
sandorski @ Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:18 pm
mtbr mtbr:
Thanos Thanos:
$1:
2. Conservative Party (abandoned traditional Canadian Conservatism for American Conservatism, starting to show some arrogance).
I dispute this point. There's no real evidence whatsoever to suggest that the current Conservatives are all that close to the hard Right of American Conservatism. The Harper Tories are dead silent on abortion and more or less diffused any controversy over gay marriage with a "no big deal" attitude about it. Contrast these two issues to the American Right, which has fighting over abortion/gays as the very reason for it's existence.
If anything Canadian Conservatives are closer to the moderate Republicans/conservative Democrats of the United States, and both of these groups are universally appalled by the crazed theoconservatism that's ruined the Republican party, and they're goping to vote for Barack Obama in a landslide. If anything, once Obama finds out which part of the spectrum the Harper Conservatives occupy he'll feel right at home with Canadian Conservatives.
Saying that the Harper Conservatives are neo-cons is really just an empty and ridiculous sound-bite invented by Canadian Liberals, who are so bereft of any new ideas of their own and who are plagued by an undeniably inept and pathetic leadership that they can now only resort to drive-by smears just to get some attention.
I agree Canadian conservatism has nothing to compare with American conservatism. That type of comment is just a cheap shot from the Liberals in this country.
Cheap shots? OMG, imagine that!
