Liberal party may break it's own laws to replace Dion.
ridenrain @ Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:18 pm
$1:
Rae, Ignatieff at odds over proposal as some party members say Dion could resign on Monday
Dec 07, 2008 08:17 PM
Comments on this story (59)
Joan Bryden
Jim Brown
THE CANADIAN PRESS
OTTAWA–The Liberal party has come up with a proposal to speed up its leadership contest and find a replacement for Stephane Dion next month – in time for a crucial budget vote that could plunge the country into an election or see the Harper Conservatives replaced by a coalition government.
The proposal, which the Liberal party executive was poised to consider by conference call late Sunday, would give every party member a vote by a combination of phone and online ballots. The idea was being vigorously promoted by leadership contender Bob Rae.
However, frontrunner Michael Ignatieff's camp was arguing that the proposal would violate the party's constitution and that the May 2 vote to choose Dion's successor should go ahead as planned.
Dec 07, 2008 08:17 PM
Comments on this story (59)
Joan Bryden
Jim Brown
THE CANADIAN PRESS
OTTAWA–The Liberal party has come up with a proposal to speed up its leadership contest and find a replacement for Stephane Dion next month – in time for a crucial budget vote that could plunge the country into an election or see the Harper Conservatives replaced by a coalition government.
The proposal, which the Liberal party executive was poised to consider by conference call late Sunday, would give every party member a vote by a combination of phone and online ballots. The idea was being vigorously promoted by leadership contender Bob Rae.
However, frontrunner Michael Ignatieff's camp was arguing that the proposal would violate the party's constitution and that the May 2 vote to choose Dion's successor should go ahead as planned.
More:
http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/549943
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZE8a4XtD ... ff-to.html
The Liblogs are aflame in indignation over this. For example:
$1:
No matter which partisan you are, or which leadership camp you support, it's undeniable that this is a blatant self serving power grab by the Ignatieff camp. It's noticeable the momentum Rae is achieving and sensing that, Ignatieff has launched this attempt to take power early and undemocratically.
If this comes to pass, the party will have alienated tens of thousands of people within the party. This goes against the very core of democracy and is unconstitutional by even the party's own standards. For a party having difficulty relating to the grassroots, you'd think that they'd have more sense than to base the parties leadership on 77 votes that represents only a quarter of Canada's constituencies is preposterous. Not even taking into account the individual membership.
I am a small l and large L Liberal. Yet if this came to pass, with the "party's higher ups" making the decisions for its base, I will have to seriously reconsider my involvement in this organization.
If this comes to pass, the party will have alienated tens of thousands of people within the party. This goes against the very core of democracy and is unconstitutional by even the party's own standards. For a party having difficulty relating to the grassroots, you'd think that they'd have more sense than to base the parties leadership on 77 votes that represents only a quarter of Canada's constituencies is preposterous. Not even taking into account the individual membership.
I am a small l and large L Liberal. Yet if this came to pass, with the "party's higher ups" making the decisions for its base, I will have to seriously reconsider my involvement in this organization.
Good thing you joined the Liberal party when you did, Derby.
Canadaka @ Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:37 pm
I really hope they do some sort of Online poll for all Liberal Party members.
PluggyRug @ Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:39 pm
Disorganised, lightly describes the current Liberal shenanigans
ridenrain @ Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:47 pm
..not being a member, I can't quore their constitution but I'd guess that all members must get a vote on this issue. An on-line poll, expecially on such short notice would have to be very sloppy and I doubt it could have the nessesart security and transparency to give all sides confidance in the results.
From the Bob Rae website:
$1:
Don’t Let Your Right to Vote be taken Away
12/8/2008
All weekend, I’d been hearing rumors about this, but today I was really surprised to read press reports about various MPs moving for an immediate vote to elect our Leader next Wednesday, in the Commons caucus.
I thought I’d seen a lot of politics over 30 years of public service, but this one really came from left field.
The idea of taking away the vote from tens of thousands of grassroots activists in every part of Canada, and reducing the franchise to just 76 men and women seems so out-of-step with the modern world. It makes you shake your head. Here’s just a quick, off-the-cuff list of things that struck me as wrong about this idea:
The activist base of the party would be unable to vote. As an MP, I’m enormously and profoundly grateful to the volunteers who sustain my political career in my riding. I cannot imagine rewarding their tireless work by removing their say in the leadership.
Significant portions of the country that didn’t elect a Liberal MP would be unable to participate. What about the voice of rural Liberals, of almost all of Western Canada, of Quebeckers outside Montreal? All of these folks would be silenced.
What about the Senate? These great Liberals, distinguished Canadians from inside and outside of politics, would have their votes taken away after lifetimes of service.
What about the Party Constitution? The party is preparing a perfectly viable, constitutionally valid plan for holding a one-member-one-vote ballot electronically in mid-January. That’s just a few weeks away, and gives us time to prepare for the Conservative budget. It’s timely, legal, workable, low-cost, and constitutional.
It’s up to us to put a stop to this hasty, ill-considered idea for electing our leader. I am raising my voice publicly for your right to vote. Please help me by raising yours as well.
12/8/2008
All weekend, I’d been hearing rumors about this, but today I was really surprised to read press reports about various MPs moving for an immediate vote to elect our Leader next Wednesday, in the Commons caucus.
I thought I’d seen a lot of politics over 30 years of public service, but this one really came from left field.
The idea of taking away the vote from tens of thousands of grassroots activists in every part of Canada, and reducing the franchise to just 76 men and women seems so out-of-step with the modern world. It makes you shake your head. Here’s just a quick, off-the-cuff list of things that struck me as wrong about this idea:
The activist base of the party would be unable to vote. As an MP, I’m enormously and profoundly grateful to the volunteers who sustain my political career in my riding. I cannot imagine rewarding their tireless work by removing their say in the leadership.
Significant portions of the country that didn’t elect a Liberal MP would be unable to participate. What about the voice of rural Liberals, of almost all of Western Canada, of Quebeckers outside Montreal? All of these folks would be silenced.
What about the Senate? These great Liberals, distinguished Canadians from inside and outside of politics, would have their votes taken away after lifetimes of service.
What about the Party Constitution? The party is preparing a perfectly viable, constitutionally valid plan for holding a one-member-one-vote ballot electronically in mid-January. That’s just a few weeks away, and gives us time to prepare for the Conservative budget. It’s timely, legal, workable, low-cost, and constitutional.
It’s up to us to put a stop to this hasty, ill-considered idea for electing our leader. I am raising my voice publicly for your right to vote. Please help me by raising yours as well.
I'm giggling away but one of the comments on one of the Liblogs sums it up best:
$1:
Western canada sends their greatest sympathies
.
OnTheIce @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 12:04 am
The Liberal camp must slow down and regroup.
Rushing to oust Dion is understandable, but take your time and ensure that you don't create more baggage with a questionable process.
Any gains they may see with a new leader may be erased with a corrupt process. The entire Liberal membership has to be on board ( and donating!). You fracture the membership and tons of $$ is at stake.
You cannot alienate your base and expect to run and election without money.
HyperionTheEvil @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:15 am
Canadaka Canadaka:
I really hope they do some sort of Online poll for all Liberal Party members.
Would you quit if they took away your ability to voe for a leader?
Tracker @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:11 am
Is the price still $1000 to become a member?
Canadaka @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:12 pm
HyperionTheEvil HyperionTheEvil:
Canadaka Canadaka:
I really hope they do some sort of Online poll for all Liberal Party members.
Would you quit if they took away your ability to voe for a leader?
No, the Liberal party has never had a 1 member one vote method of electing a leader. They send deligates to a convention. There was actualy vote to move to that model in the last convention that failed.
I do support having a vote over the internet or something. But i don't know why this is becoming a news story, it has never been that way.
Terence @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:55 pm
Never been a fan of the delegate system, but it is, what it is.
I imagine there will be some serious structural changes to facilitate a better way of turfing deadwood in the future. Or at least I hope so.
I just want some muscular leadership to start taking on the Harperites as soon as possible, WITHOUT selling out to the NDP and Bloc.
Terence @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 4:05 pm
Tracker Tracker:
Is the price still $1000 to become a member?
from my online renewal as a Liberal party member.
Membership Category - [35048] Mississauga East--Cooksville
Please Select: Riding: [35048] Mississauga East--Cooksville
Standard - $11.50 (1 Year)
The Laurier Club is $1100. The Conservatives have the Leader's Circle for those who give more than $1000. Moolah always gets you a better seat.
uwish @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 4:06 pm
either way, they will break some rules to get leadership changed.
Terence @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 4:11 pm
Bah, Harper sold out the entire Reform party and destroyed populism in the party.
At least Liberals don't have the founding core of it's membership fretting at FreeDominion and on blogs whining about how lost they are. Conservatives keep passing convention resolutions that Harper ignores. 
Liberals are optimistic about the future.
Conservatives are resigned to follow a man who ignores the social conservative grassroots.
DerbyX @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 4:21 pm
ridenrain ridenrain:
Good thing you joined the Liberal party when you did, Derby.
Yes it is. Its a good thing that when the chips are down people stand up to support their party.
I represent the little guy Liberal that they are reaching out to in ever increasing numbers as they retool their donation program.
Happy to contribute.
Tominalberta @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 4:22 pm
Haha... Hey why don't you do what you did last time... I mean aferall, very few had a say in it, and look what it gave you... DION!!!
Freakinoldguy @ Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:10 pm
Tominalberta Tominalberta:
Haha... Hey why don't you do what you did last time... I mean aferall, very few had a say in it, and look what it gave you... DION!!!
If they ended up with Dion after a delegates vote, then their party is in real trouble.
But I think that if the truth ever came out, you'd find that the Liberal Leader isn't elected, he's CROWNED, by the back room boys, one of whom is a certain Mr. Chretien.
Why would all the Liberal MP's go to Mr. Chretien for advice during the recent coalition crisis when they had a leader that "the delegates' had voted for?
It just doesn't make sense to vote someone into power and then bypass him completely, now does it.
That being said, there's appears to be a power struggle in the Liberal ranks between the left as represented by Boob Rae and the centre represented by Iggy, so given the recent left leaning tendencies of the Liberal Party, it'll be interesting to see who gets "crowned" this time, remembering that if it's Bob Rae it'll take the party a hundred years to get reelected but will show how far left the party has really drifted.