Shall we go Dutch?
Guy_Fawkes @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 6:37 pm
I dont think I have ever seen Assimilation and Liberalism on the same list before.
Brenda @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 6:43 pm
$1:
My friend wrote:
Dear friends,
I am IN FAVOR of
- Integration
- Assimilation
- freedom of mind including religion
- Liberalism,
but AGAINST
- all kind of Racism
and therefore in doubt to what extend I could support principles like the one expressed below!
Please, do me the favor and let me know how YOU think about this subject which is of importance not only for The Netherlands but at least all "western" countries including Israel and the US!
Kindest regards
I haven't answered back yet, wanted to "feel" the water here in Canada first.
No, it isn't law yet in Holland, but they'll have an election in 2013.
Dear friends,
I am IN FAVOR of
- Integration
- Assimilation
- freedom of mind including religion
- Liberalism,
but AGAINST
- all kind of Racism
and therefore in doubt to what extend I could support principles like the one expressed below!
Please, do me the favor and let me know how YOU think about this subject which is of importance not only for The Netherlands but at least all "western" countries including Israel and the US!
Kindest regards
I haven't answered back yet, wanted to "feel" the water here in Canada first.
No, it isn't law yet in Holland, but they'll have an election in 2013.
So? That does not mean that this email is less bs. IMMIGRATION and INTEGRATION is not synonymous to MUSLIMS.
The quotes in the email are correct, for as far as I can find, but the OPINION is offensive.
Most of what Donner is proposing is already done here. You are supposed to learn the language, you are supposed to integrate yourself. Sure, there is government help available in the big city, but not in the sticks. We have the burqa-ban discussion here in Canada too.
What is offensive, is that the opinion in the email singles out Muslims.
westmanguy @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:28 pm
I love Dutch people!
My boyfriend is Dutch American. Sexiest ancestral group on earth. 
dino_bobba_renno @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:35 pm
Brenda Brenda:
Piet Hein Donner sent a letter to Parliament. That does not mean it is law or ever will be. He proposed some of this.
Besides that, The Netherlands counts about 825,000 muslims. 17million people. That's not 6%.
"A parallel society"? REALLY???
Sure, there are problems with Moroccan youth. Sure, there are problems with people who we brought to the country 40, 50 years ago to do the dirty work we didn't want to do, who STILL do not speak Dutch.
But what people forget, is that once you are a resident of a European country, you can settle anywhere in the EU. Donner can yell what he want, but there is no way that he can stop "Muslim immigration" when Europe does not.
Grain of salt would be wise here.
Besides that, The Netherlands counts about 825,000 muslims. 17million people. That's not 6%.
"A parallel society"? REALLY???
Sure, there are problems with Moroccan youth. Sure, there are problems with people who we brought to the country 40, 50 years ago to do the dirty work we didn't want to do, who STILL do not speak Dutch.
But what people forget, is that once you are a resident of a European country, you can settle anywhere in the EU. Donner can yell what he want, but there is no way that he can stop "Muslim immigration" when Europe does not.
Grain of salt would be wise here.
That Brenda was an excellent post. I’d rep ya but I can’t so you’ll have to settle for my little smilie guy with a beer.
![[B-o]](./images/smilies/drinkup.gif "Drink up")
Guy_Fawkes @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:35 pm
Hey West! How come you dont post as much anymore 
dino_bobba_renno @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:36 pm
westmanguy westmanguy:
I love Dutch people!
My boyfriend is Dutch American. Sexiest ancestral group on earth.
My boyfriend is Dutch American. Sexiest ancestral group on earth.
Westman!, Welcome back big guy!
Brenda @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:50 pm
dino_bobba_renno dino_bobba_renno:
Brenda Brenda:
Piet Hein Donner sent a letter to Parliament. That does not mean it is law or ever will be. He proposed some of this.
Besides that, The Netherlands counts about 825,000 muslims. 17million people. That's not 6%.
"A parallel society"? REALLY???
Sure, there are problems with Moroccan youth. Sure, there are problems with people who we brought to the country 40, 50 years ago to do the dirty work we didn't want to do, who STILL do not speak Dutch.
But what people forget, is that once you are a resident of a European country, you can settle anywhere in the EU. Donner can yell what he want, but there is no way that he can stop "Muslim immigration" when Europe does not.
Grain of salt would be wise here.
Besides that, The Netherlands counts about 825,000 muslims. 17million people. That's not 6%.
"A parallel society"? REALLY???
Sure, there are problems with Moroccan youth. Sure, there are problems with people who we brought to the country 40, 50 years ago to do the dirty work we didn't want to do, who STILL do not speak Dutch.
But what people forget, is that once you are a resident of a European country, you can settle anywhere in the EU. Donner can yell what he want, but there is no way that he can stop "Muslim immigration" when Europe does not.
Grain of salt would be wise here.
That Brenda was an excellent post. I’d rep ya but I can’t so you’ll have to settle for my little smilie guy with a beer.
My thanks, my friend!
Brenda @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:51 pm
westmanguy westmanguy:
I love Dutch people!
My boyfriend is Dutch American. Sexiest ancestral group on earth.
My boyfriend is Dutch American. Sexiest ancestral group on earth.
Ya got class, my friend
Brenda @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:52 pm
Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:
Thanks Brenda! Lime you post is a pos.
You're welcome
And thank you
PimpBrewski123 @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 7:56 pm
lime @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 8:27 pm
Brenda Brenda:
$1:
My friend wrote:
Dear friends,
I am IN FAVOR of
- Integration
- Assimilation
- freedom of mind including religion
- Liberalism,
but AGAINST
- all kind of Racism
and therefore in doubt to what extend I could support principles like the one expressed below!
Please, do me the favor and let me know how YOU think about this subject which is of importance not only for The Netherlands but at least all "western" countries including Israel and the US!
Kindest regards
I haven't answered back yet, wanted to "feel" the water here in Canada first.
No, it isn't law yet in Holland, but they'll have an election in 2013.
Dear friends,
I am IN FAVOR of
- Integration
- Assimilation
- freedom of mind including religion
- Liberalism,
but AGAINST
- all kind of Racism
and therefore in doubt to what extend I could support principles like the one expressed below!
Please, do me the favor and let me know how YOU think about this subject which is of importance not only for The Netherlands but at least all "western" countries including Israel and the US!
Kindest regards
I haven't answered back yet, wanted to "feel" the water here in Canada first.
No, it isn't law yet in Holland, but they'll have an election in 2013.
So? That does not mean that this email is less bs. IMMIGRATION and INTEGRATION is not synonymous to MUSLIMS.
The quotes in the email are correct, for as far as I can find, but the OPINION is offensive.
Most of what Donner is proposing is already done here. You are supposed to learn the language, you are supposed to integrate yourself. Sure, there is government help available in the big city, but not in the sticks. We have the burqa-ban discussion here in Canada too.
What is offensive, is that the opinion in the email singles out Muslims.
Brenda @ Fri Mar 16, 2012 8:40 pm
There are a lot of black people too, or Asians. Should we single them out? There are a lot of Jews, also. Single them out too? What about all those white immigrants? All the things said in that email would not go for those?
It is thought that fewer than 100 women in The Netherlands wear a burqa. Stick out like sore thumbs? In a 17 million people community? Hardly.
(yeah, wearing it is banned now, just like you will get fined for walking on the street naked. No one does that, btw)
Bruce_E_T @ Sat Mar 17, 2012 1:07 am
jeff744 jeff744:
Assimilation? You mean turning all the immigrants into good, white people with 2.5 kids, a dog, and a house with a white picket fence?
Actually I think it is, on average 1.6 kids, less than replacement. That is part of the problem here. It is the immigrant population who are more likely to have the 2.5.
jeff744 @ Sat Mar 17, 2012 1:16 am
Bruce_E_T Bruce_E_T:
jeff744 jeff744:
Assimilation? You mean turning all the immigrants into good, white people with 2.5 kids, a dog, and a house with a white picket fence?
Actually I think it is, on average 1.6 kids, less than replacement. That is part of the problem here. It is the immigrant population who are more likely to have the 2.5.
I was actually making the comparison to the American dream, I knew we were below the 2.2 for replacement, but didn't know the actual number.