The price of legalizing pot is too high
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Public_Domain @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:31 pm
ASLplease @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:33 pm
DerbyX DerbyX:
That just leaves sex to give up. We'll say the same thing to everybody who drinks alcohol or coffee, smokes, or gambles. You can only have one vice so choose wisely.
Telling drug users they can use legally if they give up everything else is idiotic.
Telling drug users they can use legally if they give up everything else is idiotic.
IMO, There is absolutely nothing so sacred that it justifies giving up my morning coffee.
Even sex can be replaced with a little handy work.
ASLplease @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:35 pm
DerbyX DerbyX:
ASLplease ASLplease:
obesity is not a strain on healthcare. Obese people dont live long enough to get a serious illness.
same goes for smokers
same goes for smokers
I work in healthcare and I can tell you that statement is extremely in error. Try googling the cost associated with diabetes (a consequence of obesity) and cancer (consequence of smoking)
I can assure you the costs associated are far higher.
You are probably correct with public healthcare, but the HMOs in the states are not big on funding things like test strips and diabetes medication. I doubt that they are doing it so that it will cost them more money in the long run.
Thanos @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:45 pm
The main danger with legalizing pot is that some psychopath invariably comes along and says that identical legalization should also occur for heroin, meth, cocaine, crack, and the rest of the truly dangerous street drugs. I'd support legalization of pot if it stopped there but I'm confident that it won't. The pro-drug crowd knows that they can turn this into the mother of all slippery-slope issues, so it comes down to legal-pot-today, legal-everything-else-tomorrow.
And I call these people psychopaths for a reason. They know the massive amount of societal damage and disruption of families and the literal melting down of contibuting individual citizens into useless addicts. But they just don't care. This is a do-or-die poltical fight for them and there is no chance that they'd just stop with a victory for marijuana legalization.
OnTheIce @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:50 pm
Lemmy Lemmy:
OnTheIce OnTheIce:
These vices already cost you and I billions a year more than we make in taxes so why bend on the weed issue? Haven't we learned from the others?
There's really much more downside to legalizing pot than upside. While stoners will be happy, the rest of us will be stuck with the billions in health care costs, etc, etc.
There's really much more downside to legalizing pot than upside. While stoners will be happy, the rest of us will be stuck with the billions in health care costs, etc, etc.
That's complete horseshit. By that logic, we should criminalize the Burger King and KFC and television and video games and motorcycles and every other goddamn thing that has negative health effects.
Compare apples to apples.
Pot is already illegal. Food, motorcycles, etc aren't.
Why create more problems? Most jurisdictions ignore simple possession....let's keep it like that and not open a can of worms we can't afford to feed.
P.S. I had KFC today and it was fantastic
bootlegga @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:50 pm
OnTheIce OnTheIce:
We're way to far into the alcohol debate to turn back, same with cigarettes.
These vices already cost you and I billions a year more than we make in taxes so why bend on the weed issue? Haven't we learned from the others?
There's really much more downside to legalizing pot than upside. While stoners will be happy, the rest of us will be stuck with the billions in health care costs, etc, etc.
These vices already cost you and I billions a year more than we make in taxes so why bend on the weed issue? Haven't we learned from the others?
There's really much more downside to legalizing pot than upside. While stoners will be happy, the rest of us will be stuck with the billions in health care costs, etc, etc.
Well, maybe your province isn't doing all that well, but Alberta will take in more in gambling revenue than we'll take in from oil this year...part of that is because of lower oil prices, but nonetheless, it'll take in $1.5 billion from gambling, and $1 billion from oil.
http://ca.rss.news.yahoo.com/s/cbc/0904 ... g_revenues
I'd be willing to bet that we'll take in a pretty big number from booze and cigarette sales too.
Public_Domain @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:52 pm
bootlegga @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:54 pm
Thanos Thanos:
The main danger with legalizing pot is that some psychopath invariably comes along and says that identical legalization should also occur for heroin, meth, cocaine, crack, and the rest of the truly dangerous street drugs. I'd support legalization of pot if it stopped there but I'm confident that it won't. The pro-drug crowd knows that they can turn this into the mother of all slippery-slope issues, so it comes down to legal-pot-today, legal-everything-else-tomorrow.
I find that argument downright funny, because it's the exact same one right wing gun owners use when discussion of gun control comes up.
"Today, I can't buy an assault rifle, tomorrow I won't be able to buy a pistol and next week I won't be able to buy any gun at all. It's a slippery slope. "
RUEZ @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:57 pm
bootlegga bootlegga:
I find that argument downright funny, because it's the exact same one right wing gun owners use when discussion of gun control comes up.
Wow really? Right wing gun owners?
Lemmy @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:58 pm
OnTheIce OnTheIce:
Compare apples to apples.
Pot is already illegal. Food, motorcycles, etc aren't.
Why create more problems? Most jurisdictions ignore simple possession....let's keep it like that and not open a can of worms we can't afford to feed.
P.S. I had KFC today and it was fantastic
Pot is already illegal. Food, motorcycles, etc aren't.
Why create more problems? Most jurisdictions ignore simple possession....let's keep it like that and not open a can of worms we can't afford to feed.
P.S. I had KFC today and it was fantastic
So what if pot is already illegal? How is that of any consequence? If you want to argue that pot should be illegal, I'll likely disagree with you but I'll hear your arguments and do my best to rebute them logically. YOU'RE the one that said that pot should be illegal on the grounds that it causes illness and a burden on the healthcare system. That's YOUR argument. It's a poor argument because other legal goods cause MUCH MUCH more health care burden.
Public_Domain @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:00 pm
ridenrain @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:01 pm
Mr_Canada Mr_Canada:
Then why won't the libs put it on their platform?
Why did Iggy go formanditory minimums for drugs?
Why did the NDP flip flop over it's association with the pot party?
Again, booze and tobbaco are already legal and we never hear the end og how dangerous and distructive they are to society so why would we want to add another problem? If almost no one gets arrested for smoking pot already, why change the rules?
OnTheIce @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:03 pm
bootlegga bootlegga:
OnTheIce OnTheIce:
We're way to far into the alcohol debate to turn back, same with cigarettes.
These vices already cost you and I billions a year more than we make in taxes so why bend on the weed issue? Haven't we learned from the others?
There's really much more downside to legalizing pot than upside. While stoners will be happy, the rest of us will be stuck with the billions in health care costs, etc, etc.
These vices already cost you and I billions a year more than we make in taxes so why bend on the weed issue? Haven't we learned from the others?
There's really much more downside to legalizing pot than upside. While stoners will be happy, the rest of us will be stuck with the billions in health care costs, etc, etc.
Well, maybe your province isn't doing all that well, but Alberta will take in more in gambling revenue than we'll take in from oil this year...part of that is because of lower oil prices, but nonetheless, it'll take in $1.5 billion from gambling, and $1 billion from oil.
http://ca.rss.news.yahoo.com/s/cbc/0904 ... g_revenues
I'd be willing to bet that we'll take in a pretty big number from booze and cigarette sales too.
Yet there are many, many social costs associated with all of the above.
For example, an expert in the field of legal casinos (Earl Grinols) has said that for every $1 you've made in gambling revenue, it'll cost you $3.
OnTheIce @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:07 pm
Lemmy Lemmy:
OnTheIce OnTheIce:
Compare apples to apples.
Pot is already illegal. Food, motorcycles, etc aren't.
Why create more problems? Most jurisdictions ignore simple possession....let's keep it like that and not open a can of worms we can't afford to feed.
P.S. I had KFC today and it was fantastic
Pot is already illegal. Food, motorcycles, etc aren't.
Why create more problems? Most jurisdictions ignore simple possession....let's keep it like that and not open a can of worms we can't afford to feed.
P.S. I had KFC today and it was fantastic
So what if pot is already illegal? How is that of any consequence? If you want to argue that pot should be illegal, I'll likely disagree with you but I'll hear your arguments and do my best to rebute them logically. YOU'RE the one that said that pot should be illegal on the grounds that it causes illness and a burden on the healthcare system. That's YOUR argument. It's a poor argument because other legal goods cause MUCH MUCH more health care burden.
And yet, it's MUCH harder to turn back the clock. Yes, other legal vices cost us billions, but when it's been legal for a very long time, the chances of banning such items aren't a good possibility.
When you have something that has little to no upside, why repeat mistakes we've already made?
Thanos @ Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:09 pm
bootlegga bootlegga:
Thanos Thanos:
The main danger with legalizing pot is that some psychopath invariably comes along and says that identical legalization should also occur for heroin, meth, cocaine, crack, and the rest of the truly dangerous street drugs. I'd support legalization of pot if it stopped there but I'm confident that it won't. The pro-drug crowd knows that they can turn this into the mother of all slippery-slope issues, so it comes down to legal-pot-today, legal-everything-else-tomorrow.
I find that argument downright funny, because it's the exact same one right wing gun owners use when discussion of gun control comes up.
"Today, I can't buy an assault rifle, tomorrow I won't be able to buy a pistol and next week I won't be able to buy any gun at all. It's a slippery slope. "
Apples-to-oranges nonsense. Gun owners object to being turned into criminals by governments that blame them for everything but refuse to do anything about the real criminals who use already illegal guns to commit vicious street crimes. Not to mention that taking away an already existing right based merely on someone elses' bias is highly undemocratic. There is a right to own property in the form of a firearm. There is no right to become a crackhead and then expect that everyone else has to pay for the cost of your own personal party.
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