N Say check this out - and other economic geeks

i haven't even heard of that guy; i blame the corporate media for not paying any attention to him. but WOW all that stuff looks very interesting. i guess he's cut from the same cloth as gordon laxer, stephen clarkson, eric reguly, glen williams & mel watkins. too bad we never hear what they have to say, if we did i think there would be a heck of a change. there's another book called "the structure of the canadian capitalist class" by robert brym which is also supposed to be good, but i haven't read that either. (i didn't know i was an economic geek? <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/wink.gif' alt='Wink'> ) ... & he's got a website <a href="http://www.er.uqam.ca/nobel/r21010/eng.htm">here</a>, with some .pdf publications to download, & other info he's even a fellow of the royal society of canada (the highest honour one can get for doing research) & won the 1983 john porter book prize (also won by gordon laxer & stephen clarkson)!

there's a guy called RT Naylor (aka Tom Naylor) who apparently has done the definitive study on the creation of our branch-plant economy. It's his epic "History of Canadian Business 1867-1914". I've got it from my school library & it just about every chapter is like a book inside a book. There are hundred-page chapters with 240-300 sources at the end. & somehow people don't know about it! here's the description by from the publisher**: "This reissue, in one volume, of the 1975 classic tells the story, sometimes grand, more often sordid, of the development of Canadian big business--of banks and railways, industrial trusts and commercial cartels--from Confederation to the First World War. It is at once a treatise on economic development and of what would today be called white collar crime. Broadly praised and roundly condemned at the time of publication, The History of Canadian Business has been acknowledged by the Social Sciences Federation of Canda as one of the most outstanding works ever written in Canadian economic history, on par with Harold Innis' The Fur Trade in Canada. Part I on the banks and finance capital, tells the story of the growth of the Canadian chartered banking system. Included is an analysis of the many bank failures, and an explanation of the techniques used successfully by the largest chartered banks to dominate banking and finance in the new Canadian confederation. Several chapters deal with hitherto unrecorded facets of the development of the financial system of Canada, the major financial institutions and the types of operations they financed. Part II tells the story of the development of manufacturing and industry. The rapid growth of foreign branch plants which followed the National Policy are closely examined, as are business assistance measures like patent laws, tariffs, government subsidies and municipal 'bonusing.' Naylor offers detailed accounts of the rise of big business through the formation of cartels and mergers assembled out of smaller independent operations. This section includes Canada in the Post-Columbian Age which deals in part with the decline of the Canadian federal system." http://www.web.net/blackrosebooks/histcanb.htm here's what Mel Watkins had to say about it: "the Social Science Federation of Canada decides to honour the 20 most outstanding books among the some 2,000 titles that have been subsidized over the 50 years in which this has been done. Two books in Canadian economic history make the list. The first is the monumental Fur Trade in Canada by the great Harold Innis. The second is History of Canadian Business 1867-1914 by R.T. Naylor. Enough said. Read on." ** the publisher is Black Rose, which is a nonprofit collective, perhaps similar to South End Press in the US. They've got all kinds of other good radical stuff, including lots of environmental & anarchist books.

[QUOTE BY= N Say] there's a guy called RT Naylor (aka Tom Naylor) who apparently has done the definitive study on the creation of our branch-plant economy. It's his epic "History of Canadian Business 1867-1914". I've got it from my school library & it just about every chapter is like a book inside a book. There are hundred-page chapters with 240-300 sources at the end. & somehow people don't know about it! here's the description by from the publisher**: "This reissue, in one volume, of the 1975 classic tells the story, sometimes grand, more often sordid, of the development of Canadian big business--of banks and railways, industrial trusts and commercial cartels--from Confederation to the First World War. It is at once a treatise on economic development and of what would today be called white collar crime. Broadly praised and roundly condemned at the time of publication, The History of Canadian Business has been acknowledged by the Social Sciences Federation of Canda as one of the most outstanding works ever written in Canadian economic history, on par with Harold Innis' The Fur Trade in Canada. Part I on the banks and finance capital, tells the story of the growth of the Canadian chartered banking system. Included is an analysis of the many bank failures, and an explanation of the techniques used successfully by the largest chartered banks to dominate banking and finance in the new Canadian confederation. Several chapters deal with hitherto unrecorded facets of the development of the financial system of Canada, the major financial institutions and the types of operations they financed. Part II tells the story of the development of manufacturing and industry. The rapid growth of foreign branch plants which followed the National Policy are closely examined, as are business assistance measures like patent laws, tariffs, government subsidies and municipal 'bonusing.' Naylor offers detailed accounts of the rise of big business through the formation of cartels and mergers assembled out of smaller independent operations. This section includes Canada in the Post-Columbian Age which deals in part with the decline of the Canadian federal system." http://www.web.net/blackrosebooks/histcanb.htm here's what Mel Watkins had to say about it: "the Social Science Federation of Canada decides to honour the 20 most outstanding books among the some 2,000 titles that have been subsidized over the 50 years in which this has been done. Two books in Canadian economic history make the list. The first is the monumental Fur Trade in Canada by the great Harold Innis. The second is History of Canadian Business 1867-1914 by R.T. Naylor. Enough said. Read on." ** the publisher is Black Rose, which is a nonprofit collective, perhaps similar to South End Press in the US. They've got all kinds of other good radical stuff, including lots of environmental & anarchist books.[/QUOTE] Thanks a lot. This is a great find. <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/wink.gif' alt='Wink'>

here's the epigraph for chapter 13: "Independence is a farce. Canada must belong either to the British system or the American system... If we had to make the choice between independence and annexation, I would rather that we should have annexation and join with the United States at once." & you'll never guess who said that... it was John A MacDonald!!! in 1881!!! <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/exclaim.gif' alt='Exclaimation'> <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/eek.gif' alt='Eek!'> <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/exclaim.gif' alt='Exclaimation'> Naylor doesn't list where he read that, so I'd have to email him about it. If the rest of the book is anything to go by, I would say that Macdonald really did say it.

Presuming that it’s an accurate quote, it would be interesting to know whether that was a diary entry or part of a conversation. (If the latter, my first thought was that it might have been said to potential investors in the Canadian Pacific.) The audience, or lack thereof, might give a clue as to whether he actually believed what was said…

Thanks for the Black Rose link N Say.Lots of good books there!<img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/biggrin.gif' alt='Big Grin'>

[QUOTE BY= N Say] here's the epigraph for chapter 13: "Independence is a farce. Canada must belong either to the British system or the American system... If we had to make the choice between independence and annexation, I would rather that we should have annexation and join with the United States at once." & you'll never guess who said that... it was John A MacDonald!!! in 1881!!! <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/exclaim.gif' alt='Exclaimation'> <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/eek.gif' alt='Eek!'> <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/exclaim.gif' alt='Exclaimation'> Naylor doesn't list where he read that, so I'd have to email him about it. If the rest of the book is anything to go by, I would say that Macdonald really did say it.[/QUOTE] Maybe he was drunk. <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/mrgreen.gif' alt='Mr. Green'> Anyway, although I was shocked initially, perhaps it is possible that he had simply lost confidence in Canada, and its ability to be independent? Was he simply going along with the popular view as Chretien has done a lot on free trade, despite his opposition to it?

[QUOTE BY= Spud] Thanks for the Black Rose link N Say.Lots of good books there!<img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/biggrin.gif' alt='Big Grin'> [/QUOTE] yeah i think you might like this one: http://www.web.net/blackrosebooks/anarism.htm (they've got a table of contents & preface online) it's also the only publisher that has published the complete works of peter kropotkin