Homeless man was kicked 'like a football,' trial told
Newsbot @ Wed Mar 19, 2008 1:32 am
<strong>Title: </strong> <a href="/article/235929722-homeless-man-was-kicked-like-a-football-trial-told" target="_blank">Homeless man was kicked 'like a football,' trial told</a>
<strong>Category:</strong> <a href="/topics/67-civil-liberties-and-privacy" target="_blank">Civil Liberties and Privacy</a>
<strong>Written By: </strong> <a href="/profiles/rearguard" target="_blank">rearguard</a>
<strong>Date: </strong> Wednesday, March 19 at 14:44<br><br>
Mar 18, 2008 04:30 AM<br>
Peter Small<br>
Courts Bureau<br>
<br>
Three Canadian soldiers kicked Paul Croutch, a sleeping homeless man, "like a football," then assaulted a woman who tried to intervene, warning her that "bums" aren't welcome in Toronto's Moss Park, a prosecutor says.<br>
<br>
"`Tell all your friends the park is ours. We own it,'" Pte. Brian Deganis told Valerie Valen as he and two fellow reservists dragged and hit her, assistant Crown attorney Hank Goody alleged yesterday, outlining evidence he expects to present.<br>
<br>
Deganis thrust his military dog tags into her face, "saying that they gave them the right to do whatever they wanted to her and all derelict homeless bums," Goody told a jury as he opened the Crown's case.<br><a href="/article/235929722-homeless-man-was-kicked-like-a-football-trial-told">read more >></a>
a1frenchy @ Wed Mar 19, 2008 1:32 am
These three heartless assholes should be thrown out of the military immediately, and be tried for murder, then be given a seat in old sparky. Sounds like the problem is a fucked up mentality, and not just booze. At any rate I'm sure that most soldiers serving in Canada's Military would be the first to agree. I still can't get my mind around the fact the some people can be that fucking cruel. WTF!
rearguard @ Wed Mar 19, 2008 10:35 pm
Here's the thing, how could these guys *not* be noticed as being seriously fucked up in the head by their commanders? The answer may be that as trained combat soldiers, this kind of behaviour is considered perfectly normal, at least from what they see as the example being set in Afghanistan and Iraq. Yes, and I know that Canadian soldiers are not in Iraq, however they are being led under US military command in Afghanistan, therefore their US leaders are indeed setting the example, where torture and murder of the defenseless is considered acceptable from the highest levels on down.
Diogenes @ Wed Mar 19, 2008 11:48 pm
Gunny sacked and transported to an out of the way location and repeatedly tortured revived and tourtured for weeks on end
released then recaptured to repeat more weeks of torture released then crippled
all of which should be videoed and released to the public
time to clean up the gene pool!
a1frenchy @ Fri Apr 04, 2008 12:37 pm
I find it hard to believe that because they are combat trained soldiers that they don't realize what they did was wrong,WTF! This was a homeless person who could not have defended himself even if he had not been sleeping. It sure is a scary world we live in when the value of life has dropped so much that it is raising its ugly head even in the Canadian Military. I hope that our soldiers are not trained to be so cruel. This was a human being and not a bag of garbage!
kenmore @ Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:45 pm
bring back the death penalty ... that will fix em...
Freakinoldguy @ Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:20 pm
The problem here isn't the Military, it's the attitude of a few fucked up people who because of lax recruiting got in. The Military is a reflection of society and you're always going to have a few social deviants despite the batteries of mental tests they do.
You can't discipline out or even control sociopathic behaviour. So despite wearing a uniform these three criminals are in no way a reflection of the Military. It's just as likely that had they not been military, they'd be wearing some other gang identifier and telling the victims that the patch or colours gave them the right to do what they did.
As for punishment, after they have served their likely too short sentences, their probation should include 3 years of living on the street in the worst neighbourhood in Canada with no income and no chance to improve their life for the period. And as an added bonus there should be an ad placed on local TV and newspapers to be handed out to other homeless people telling them just what these three assholes did.
Diogenes @ Fri Apr 04, 2008 6:20 pm
Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:
The problem here isn't the Military, it's the attitude of a few fucked up people who because of lax recruiting got in. The Military is a reflection of society and you're always going to have a few social deviants despite the batteries of mental tests they do.
You can't discipline out or even control sociopathic behaviour. So despite wearing a uniform these three criminals are in no way a reflection of the Military. It's just as likely that had they not been military, they'd be wearing some other gang identifier and telling the victims that the patch or colours gave them the right to do what they did.
As for punishment, after they have served their likely too short sentences, their probation should include 3 years of living on the street in the worst neighbourhood in Canada with no income and no chance to improve their life for the period. And as an added bonus there should be an ad placed on local TV and newspapers to be handed out to other homeless people telling them just what these three assholes did.
You can't discipline out or even control sociopathic behaviour. So despite wearing a uniform these three criminals are in no way a reflection of the Military. It's just as likely that had they not been military, they'd be wearing some other gang identifier and telling the victims that the patch or colours gave them the right to do what they did.
As for punishment, after they have served their likely too short sentences, their probation should include 3 years of living on the street in the worst neighbourhood in Canada with no income and no chance to improve their life for the period. And as an added bonus there should be an ad placed on local TV and newspapers to be handed out to other homeless people telling them just what these three assholes did.
Faulty logic FOG
The problen is in deed, the military. They do the recruiting. ergo their resonsibility.
If as you say sociopathic behaviopurs can not be disaplined or controled no amount of time living on the street will bring about any changes desired, especially when it is "punishment"
I say eliminated them entirerly from the gene pool.
Harsh?
Yup
Soon the worlds peoples will be under the control of the New World Order, do you think, THAT control will put up with shit like this?
What ever anyone sees as radical religious Islamic, Christion of Zionist Jewish will now be done under the NWO
Freewill is wasted on the top to the bottom and bottom to top
The answer is Licenced to Kill snipers that execute at point of infraction.
One false move and POOF!
Your head explode like ripe watermellon
Zere vill be NO mercy
Bwaaa hahaha
so mind your P's and Q's
You are being vatched
sasquatch2 @ Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:57 pm
It is unfortunate that these criminals happened to be reservists.
Blaming the military is pointless----there have been numerous examples lately of Police misconduct----to problem is despite the best safeguards and checks a few rotten apples slip through the system.
It unfortuantely the human condition.
We have a mechanism in place---these twits will be treated differently(more harshly) by the system than if they were civilians----perhaps polishing garbage cans at Club Ed....
kenmore @ Sat Apr 05, 2008 1:06 pm
no one is accountable for anothers actions... the military, parents, school what ever. these guys need to be given harsh sentences...
Freakinoldguy @ Sat Apr 05, 2008 1:13 pm
Diogenes Diogenes:
Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:
The problem here isn't the Military, it's the attitude of a few fucked up people who because of lax recruiting got in. The Military is a reflection of society and you're always going to have a few social deviants despite the batteries of mental tests they do.
You can't discipline out or even control sociopathic behaviour. So despite wearing a uniform these three criminals are in no way a reflection of the Military. It's just as likely that had they not been military, they'd be wearing some other gang identifier and telling the victims that the patch or colours gave them the right to do what they did.
As for punishment, after they have served their likely too short sentences, their probation should include 3 years of living on the street in the worst neighbourhood in Canada with no income and no chance to improve their life for the period. And as an added bonus there should be an ad placed on local TV and newspapers to be handed out to other homeless people telling them just what these three assholes did.
You can't discipline out or even control sociopathic behaviour. So despite wearing a uniform these three criminals are in no way a reflection of the Military. It's just as likely that had they not been military, they'd be wearing some other gang identifier and telling the victims that the patch or colours gave them the right to do what they did.
As for punishment, after they have served their likely too short sentences, their probation should include 3 years of living on the street in the worst neighbourhood in Canada with no income and no chance to improve their life for the period. And as an added bonus there should be an ad placed on local TV and newspapers to be handed out to other homeless people telling them just what these three assholes did.
Faulty logic FOG
The problen is in deed, the military. They do the recruiting. ergo their resonsibility.
If as you say sociopathic behaviopurs can not be disaplined or controled no amount of time living on the street will bring about any changes desired, especially when it is "punishment"
I say eliminated them entirerly from the gene pool.
Harsh?
Yup
Soon the worlds peoples will be under the control of the New World Order, do you think, THAT control will put up with shit like this?
What ever anyone sees as radical religious Islamic, Christion of Zionist Jewish will now be done under the NWO
Freewill is wasted on the top to the bottom and bottom to top
The answer is Licenced to Kill snipers that execute at point of infraction.
One false move and POOF!
Your head explode like ripe watermellon
Zere vill be NO mercy
Bwaaa hahaha
so mind your P's and Q's
You are being vatched
Your right it is the Militaries responsibility to weed out deviants like these three after they enrolled them. The problem is that their behaviour problems don't arise at an interview or in recruit school so, much like in society, you have to wait till they actually commit the crime before your realise you have a major cluster fuck on your hands.
While I was in, I knew of one person who murdered an entire family, then went back to his ship and climbed into his bunk to get his head down as if nothing had happened. Prior to this happening there was no indication that he was homicidal or even a problem sailor. So, saying the military is responsible for his actions is like saying women were responsible for Mark Lepine's. It doesn't wash.
A person is responsible for their own actions whether they are in a uniform or not. The Military, after the fact, is now responsible for ensuring these three get a fair trial and if found guilty, releasing them post haste so they don't languish on the books while doing time in a federal penitentiary.
I agree with the gene pool anecdote, but given our "current" political climate I doubt very much any of these little scitzoids will get anything resembling a proper punishment and thats why I suggested that they live on the street after all the street people have been informed of what they've done. These fuckers have to sleep sometime, but waking up isn't a necessity.
Diogenes @ Sat Apr 05, 2008 1:43 pm
" So, saying the military is responsible for his actions is like saying women were responsible for Mark Lepine's. It doesn't wash."
gain with the faulty logic
As a mariner I had to sign "the Articles" or make my mark what ever the case.
The Skipper was responsible for his crew on ship and off
Samies for the military
There are distinctions. A being is, when in control of their faculties responsible for their actions and under law responsible to society. Unfortunately that is a one way street as society disavows responsibility for us.
As you say an after the fact element exists and goes to prove my point that those under command are also under the responsibility of the command
It Dr.C weighs in on this he can put us both straight
Vigilant justice as defined by the meaning of the word Vigilant opens the doors to areas the cops.
It is only those who "taken" authority tha whine about taking the law into ones own hands
There is much in favour of public humuliation
the stocks coe to mind as does public flogging
after a fair trial
Notice I said fair not a bought and paid for trial