Two seventeen year old 'boys' arrested for murder
ziggy @ Mon May 28, 2007 3:41 pm
GreatBriton GreatBriton:
Under British law you are treated as an adult when you are just 10 years old.
In 1993, two 10 years old boys murdered 2 year old James Bulger. They were sentenced to 15 years in jail.
The last time I checked, Canada has one of the Top 10 crime rates in the world.
Both Britain and the US aren't in the Top 10. Maybe punishments for crimes are tougher in Britain and the US than they are in Canada.
In 1993, two 10 years old boys murdered 2 year old James Bulger. They were sentenced to 15 years in jail.
The last time I checked, Canada has one of the Top 10 crime rates in the world.
Both Britain and the US aren't in the Top 10. Maybe punishments for crimes are tougher in Britain and the US than they are in Canada.
We may be #10 on the list but you folks are #6
Try again.Britians crime rates higher then Canada's
Remember now these are REPORTED crime rates
$1:
Country Crime Rate
Iceland 14,726.95
Sweden 13,455.08
New Zealand 12,586.64
Grenada 10,177.89
Norway 10,086.72
England & Wales 9,823.38
Denmark 9,460.38
Finland 8,697.37
Scotland 8,428.97
Canada 4,123.97
Iceland 14,726.95
Sweden 13,455.08
New Zealand 12,586.64
Grenada 10,177.89
Norway 10,086.72
England & Wales 9,823.38
Denmark 9,460.38
Finland 8,697.37
Scotland 8,428.97
Canada 4,123.97
sasquatch2 @ Mon May 28, 2007 4:00 pm
ziggy
$1:
We may be #10 on the list but you folks are #6 Try again.
Britians crime rates higher then Canada's
Remember now these are REPORTED crime rates
Britians crime rates higher then Canada's
Remember now these are REPORTED crime rates
Maybe I missed something here.......I checked that link and NO AUTHORITY WAS REPORTED for these "statistics".
It made the Bizarre claim that Iceland was one of the safest nations on earth but then asigned iceland the highest number......what do these numbers represent???---violent crime, illegal parking, fraud, murder, shootings per 10,000.......per million....WHAT????????
There is no authority hence we have no idea whether these are reported government stats or just figures cooked up by some boffin at "Gun Control INC.".
hwacker @ Mon May 28, 2007 4:02 pm
Delwin Delwin:
http://www.justice.gc.ca/en/ps/rs/rep/2006/rr06-2/t7.html
In 2002, 4948 Firearms were reported stolen or missing.
In 2003, 6690 Firearms were reported stolen or missing.
In 2004, 5631 Firearms were reported stolen or missing.
Now of course, these are just based on the reported incidents, and don't include the gun nuts who were too embrrased to report them missing or traded them for chewing tobacco. So you are right Hwacker, these numbers could be way lower than the actual total.
In 2002, 4948 Firearms were reported stolen or missing.
In 2003, 6690 Firearms were reported stolen or missing.
In 2004, 5631 Firearms were reported stolen or missing.
Now of course, these are just based on the reported incidents, and don't include the gun nuts who were too embrrased to report them missing or traded them for chewing tobacco. So you are right Hwacker, these numbers could be way lower than the actual total.
chewing tobacco?
do you ever get out of your mother's house ?
ridenrain @ Mon May 28, 2007 4:34 pm
sasquatch2 sasquatch2:
Stick to the facts and leave your leftist urban myths and smears at the door.
That's all they have! Look at all this shite he's spouting.
We don't make laws to prevent the repitition of 300 Canadians burning in airline terrorism and we don't do aything to punish people like the Homulkas and the Pictons from horrid wholesale murder, but here we're going to change the law based on 2 of possibly the poorest and least edjucated "Canadians" in the country.
When they raided the house for this guy, they found a number of other firearms. Sounds like a problem that's a bit bigger than just a couple scapegoat collectors.
ziggy @ Mon May 28, 2007 5:10 pm
sasquatch2 sasquatch2:
ziggy
Maybe I missed something here.......I checked that link and NO AUTHORITY WAS REPORTED for these "statistics".
It made the Bizarre claim that Iceland was one of the safest nations on earth but then asigned iceland the highest number......what do these numbers represent???---violent crime, illegal parking, fraud, murder, shootings per 10,000.......per million....WHAT????????
There is no authority hence we have no idea whether these are reported government stats or just figures cooked up by some boffin at "Gun Control INC.".
$1:
We may be #10 on the list but you folks are #6 Try again.
Britians crime rates higher then Canada's
Remember now these are REPORTED crime rates
Britians crime rates higher then Canada's
Remember now these are REPORTED crime rates
Maybe I missed something here.......I checked that link and NO AUTHORITY WAS REPORTED for these "statistics".
It made the Bizarre claim that Iceland was one of the safest nations on earth but then asigned iceland the highest number......what do these numbers represent???---violent crime, illegal parking, fraud, murder, shootings per 10,000.......per million....WHAT????????
There is no authority hence we have no idea whether these are reported government stats or just figures cooked up by some boffin at "Gun Control INC.".
I'm still laughing,it's a play on words.
World Top 10 - Countries With Highest Reported Crime Rates
I think
the - should be after "countries"
ridenrain @ Mon May 28, 2007 5:27 pm
$1:
Communities left 'terrified' by rise in inner-city shootings
By Terry Kirby, Chief Reporter
Published: 30 September 2006
The recent growth in gun crime on the streets of Britain's inner-city areas is "terrifying", police have admitted, following a spate of shootings in London and Manchester on Thursday night, which left three teenagers injured.
In Manchester, detectives denied they were losing control of the Moss Side area after a 16-year-old girl was shot in the street in an attack which some have linked to the murder of Jesse James, 15, earlier this month. At the same time in London, community leaders said the shooting of two black teenagers in a McDonald's in Brixton had left people in a state of shock.
The shootings come in the wake of a series of violent incidents this week. In Nottingham, Nathan Williams, 17, was shot dead while cycling through the city in Tuesday, while four unconnected shootings in London over the past week have left four people seriously injured and one man, aged 22, dead. Despite the large numbers of teenagers involved in such incidents, the Home Office said it had no separate statistics on the ages of gun crime victims, although it is well established that young people, particularly males, are the highest risk category for all violent crime.
Chief Superintendent David Thompson, who is in charge of the Moss Side and Whalley Range areas, added: "No, we're not losing control. But we don't underestimate the seriousness of this problem. The volume of gun crime has risen worryingly since August. But to the people who think we're not doing enough I would say I completely understand how concerned they are. It is terrifying."
He added: "The problem we face is that there are a small number of people who have a determined desire to engage in gun conflict. We're continuing to target them but we need continued support from the community to tell us what's going on and where these guns are. There's no excuse for being scared."
By Terry Kirby, Chief Reporter
Published: 30 September 2006
The recent growth in gun crime on the streets of Britain's inner-city areas is "terrifying", police have admitted, following a spate of shootings in London and Manchester on Thursday night, which left three teenagers injured.
In Manchester, detectives denied they were losing control of the Moss Side area after a 16-year-old girl was shot in the street in an attack which some have linked to the murder of Jesse James, 15, earlier this month. At the same time in London, community leaders said the shooting of two black teenagers in a McDonald's in Brixton had left people in a state of shock.
The shootings come in the wake of a series of violent incidents this week. In Nottingham, Nathan Williams, 17, was shot dead while cycling through the city in Tuesday, while four unconnected shootings in London over the past week have left four people seriously injured and one man, aged 22, dead. Despite the large numbers of teenagers involved in such incidents, the Home Office said it had no separate statistics on the ages of gun crime victims, although it is well established that young people, particularly males, are the highest risk category for all violent crime.
Chief Superintendent David Thompson, who is in charge of the Moss Side and Whalley Range areas, added: "No, we're not losing control. But we don't underestimate the seriousness of this problem. The volume of gun crime has risen worryingly since August. But to the people who think we're not doing enough I would say I completely understand how concerned they are. It is terrifying."
He added: "The problem we face is that there are a small number of people who have a determined desire to engage in gun conflict. We're continuing to target them but we need continued support from the community to tell us what's going on and where these guns are. There's no excuse for being scared."
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/crime/ ... 772343.ece
Remember, this is the UK where handguns are banned and other firearms are very rare.
Scrappy @ Mon May 28, 2007 5:30 pm
When the left/left get "Legal Hand" guns/revolvers off the street then the slime sucking little criminals will turn to knives then the left/left will ban knives and then when the little scum start shaving spoons we as a society will be eating liguids out of straws but but but it will be for our own good. The left know what is best, come on people they really really care about the Criminals. The rest of us should do as we are told, the left/left know what is best or elseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee they shall bore us to DEATH with their prattle and tripe not to be confused with snotting and bawling okay.
Delwin @ Mon May 28, 2007 5:37 pm
This is from Britain as well, where handguns have been banned.
Friday January 26, 2007
$1:
The fall in gun crime, down from 11,371 incidents to 9,728 in the year to last September, was welcomed by the Home Office minister Tony McNulty. But he acknowledged the small increase in residential robberies involving firearms: "We have some of the toughest firearms legislation in Europe. Anyone convicted of having a prohibited firearm faces a minimum five-year sentence."
The number of people killed in gun attacks was unchanged at 57 - down from a peak of more than 70 two years ago.
The number of people killed in gun attacks was unchanged at 57 - down from a peak of more than 70 two years ago.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/frontpage/sto ... 01,00.html
ridenrain @ Mon May 28, 2007 5:41 pm
Delwin Delwin:
This is from Britain as well, where handguns have been banned.
Friday January 26, 2007
http://www.guardian.co.uk/frontpage/sto ... 01,00.html
Friday January 26, 2007
$1:
Anyone convicted of having a prohibited firearm faces a minimum five-year sentence."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/frontpage/sto ... 01,00.html
I believe you said that minimums had no effect? How can you say their system is working yet say that minimum sentences don't work. If in fact they do work, as you're suggesting here, why don't the Liberals and NDP get on with it and pass those laws?
(Check)
Delwin @ Mon May 28, 2007 5:44 pm
Scrappy Scrappy:
When the left/left get "Legal Hand" guns/revolvers off the street then the slime sucking little criminals will turn to knives then the left/left will ban knives and then when the little scum start shaving spoons we as a society will be eating liguids out of straws but but but it will be for our own good. The left know what is best, come on people they really really care about the Criminals. The rest of us should do as we are told, the left/left know what is best or elseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee they shall bore us to DEATH with their prattle and tripe not to be confused with snotting and bawling okay.
When the right/right gets it through their heads that human lives are more important than their precious killing machines then maybe we can pass some real legislation and deal with this issue. Okay.
toothpick @ Mon May 28, 2007 5:47 pm
Delwin:
When a gun is stolen and used in a shooting there are two victims. The person who got shot and the legal owner whose gun was stolen.
Your solution to stolen handguns is to ban handguns, but that's nothing more than blaming the victim. You are trying to infringe on someone's well established civil liberty in the belief that restricting a law abiding citizens behavior will somehow change the behavior of those who break the law. A legal handgun owner is made the victim of a crime and your solution is to say "well, you shouldn't have been owning those." It's quite literally the same as trying to ban revealing cloths in a vain attempt to prevent sexual assault.
The person whose behavior has to change is the criminal who is stealing guns, not the person who legally obtains them.
Delwin @ Mon May 28, 2007 5:53 pm
ridenrain ridenrain:
Delwin Delwin:
This is from Britain as well, where handguns have been banned.
Friday January 26, 2007
http://www.guardian.co.uk/frontpage/sto ... 01,00.html
Friday January 26, 2007
$1:
Anyone convicted of having a prohibited firearm faces a minimum five-year sentence."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/frontpage/sto ... 01,00.html
I believe you said that minimums had no effect? How can you say their system is working yet say that minimum sentences don't work. If in fact they do work, as you're suggesting here, why don't the Liberals and NDP get on with it and pass those laws?
(Check)
From 2004 Campaign Platform:
$1:
The Liberals plan to re-introduce legislation to combat gun crime which would double mandatory minimum sentences for key gun crimes, such as trafficking and smuggling of firearms and the illegal possession of loaded handguns in public places. The legislation was introduced just days before the 2006 Canadian federal election was called.
And there you go with the holding up bills argument again. What do the Cons have to do to convince you it is them holding up parliament, write down all of the steps, put in in a book, and hand it to every Conservative Committee Chair ? Oh wait they already did that. Nevermind.
Scrappy @ Mon May 28, 2007 6:04 pm
toothpick toothpick:
Delwin:
When a gun is stolen and used in a shooting there are two victims. The person who got shot and the legal owner whose gun was stolen.
Your solution to stolen handguns is to ban handguns, but that's nothing more than blaming the victim. You are trying to infringe on someone's well established civil liberty in the belief that restricting a law abiding citizens behavior will somehow change the behavior of those who break the law. A legal handgun owner is made the victim of a crime and your solution is to say "well, you shouldn't have been owning those." It's quite literally the same as trying to ban revealing cloths in a vain attempt to prevent sexual assault.
The person whose behavior has to change is the criminal who is stealing guns, not the person who legally obtains them.
When a gun is stolen and used in a shooting there are two victims. The person who got shot and the legal owner whose gun was stolen.
Your solution to stolen handguns is to ban handguns, but that's nothing more than blaming the victim. You are trying to infringe on someone's well established civil liberty in the belief that restricting a law abiding citizens behavior will somehow change the behavior of those who break the law. A legal handgun owner is made the victim of a crime and your solution is to say "well, you shouldn't have been owning those." It's quite literally the same as trying to ban revealing cloths in a vain attempt to prevent sexual assault.
The person whose behavior has to change is the criminal who is stealing guns, not the person who legally obtains them.
Yep Darwin would rather punish the "Law abiding Citizens of Canada" than take on the criminal element I'll name pond scum. So a little piece of garbage breaks into your home steals your "Legal" guns and commences to killing innocents and it's not the scums fault it's the citizen doing his legal duty. God I'm so confused by the left/left my pa always told me not to have a battle of wits with the disadvantaged but it's so hard not to fight with a person with the IQ of a "house plant".
Well the right/right are trying to give freedom to women and childen in Afghanistan, no machines required except to kill the barbaric assholes that think women should be living in under ground caves but hay that's not a worthy cause to the left/left. Women and children are the first to go to save criminal scum aren't they Darwin. Soldier on Darwin, your ethos has more holes than Swiss Cheese but please get pelted by the Legal Gun owners on this forum. I like the sight of the left/left's blood just as the left/left like to see hardcore criminals "Rehabilitated" jesus what a joke.
Delwin @ Mon May 28, 2007 6:15 pm
toothpick toothpick:
Delwin:
When a gun is stolen and used in a shooting there are two victims. The person who got shot and the legal owner whose gun was stolen.
Your solution to stolen handguns is to ban handguns, but that's nothing more than blaming the victim. You are trying to infringe on someone's well established civil liberty in the belief that restricting a law abiding citizens behavior will somehow change the behavior of those who break the law. A legal handgun owner is made the victim of a crime and your solution is to say "well, you shouldn't have been owning those." It's quite literally the same as trying to ban revealing cloths in a vain attempt to prevent sexual assault.
The person whose behavior has to change is the criminal who is stealing guns, not the person who legally obtains them.
It is refreshing to hear a valid argument Toothpick, instead of arguing against the well established facts, you have brought a valid point forth. It is unfortunate that those who are responsible gun owners would have to compensate their lives because of the crimes of a few. When a gun is stolen and used in a shooting there are two victims. The person who got shot and the legal owner whose gun was stolen.
Your solution to stolen handguns is to ban handguns, but that's nothing more than blaming the victim. You are trying to infringe on someone's well established civil liberty in the belief that restricting a law abiding citizens behavior will somehow change the behavior of those who break the law. A legal handgun owner is made the victim of a crime and your solution is to say "well, you shouldn't have been owning those." It's quite literally the same as trying to ban revealing cloths in a vain attempt to prevent sexual assault.
The person whose behavior has to change is the criminal who is stealing guns, not the person who legally obtains them.
During the Election, that issue was address with this measure:
$1:
* The Liberals will amend the Criminal Code of Canada to let provinces and territories ban handguns, including an amnesty program and a buy-back program to collect existing handguns.
As painful as it might be for a gun owner who might have to part with a weapon that could have untold sentimental value, etc., my sympathies will always lie with the families of the innocent victims.
I have already posted cases on another thread, were the criminal scaled a building and used torches and a pry bar to break into a 1700lb Brinks safe. So regardless of how responsible an owner you believe you are, if the criminals want your guns bad enough, they can get them.
ridenrain @ Mon May 28, 2007 6:28 pm
Sorry dude.. the secret of fire is out:
$1:
A 17-year-old Halton Hills youth may face charges after accidentally shooting himself in the hand with a homemade gun.
...
"There is no evidence at this time to suggest that the manufacture of these firearms were for (any) other purpose than to be used for target practice and to satiate youthful curiosity," police added in a release.
The investigation continues and police say charges are pending.
...
"There is no evidence at this time to suggest that the manufacture of these firearms were for (any) other purpose than to be used for target practice and to satiate youthful curiosity," police added in a release.
The investigation continues and police say charges are pending.
http://www.hamiltonspectator.com/NASApp ... 4656511815
This was "youthful curiosity". Do you have any doubt that some enterprising individual would not find ways of making what they want? As we saw in the UK, where handguns have been illegal for decades, they still get them.
$1:
Vancouver police make major weapons seizure
Updated Sat. Apr. 28 2007 10:52 PM ET
CTV.ca News Staff
Vancouver police carted out what appeared to be a tripod-mounted, military-style machine gun from a high-rise apartment, just one part of a major weapons seizure.
Police say they pulled over a large moving. Inside, they found explosives and restricted firearms, including two sawed-off shotguns.
Brass knuckles, blasting caps and two crossbows with hunting arrows were also seized, along with several boxes of ammunition.
Police believe some of the guns were from the central Vancouver Island community of Duncan.
Updated Sat. Apr. 28 2007 10:52 PM ET
CTV.ca News Staff
Vancouver police carted out what appeared to be a tripod-mounted, military-style machine gun from a high-rise apartment, just one part of a major weapons seizure.
Police say they pulled over a large moving. Inside, they found explosives and restricted firearms, including two sawed-off shotguns.
Brass knuckles, blasting caps and two crossbows with hunting arrows were also seized, along with several boxes of ammunition.
Police believe some of the guns were from the central Vancouver Island community of Duncan.
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/s ... TopStories
I posted right at the start of this about an RCMP officer who was working with the mob to get them guns.
A ban would have had no effect on all 3 of these cases, cost a great deal and saved less lives than a national program to teach children to swim.