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Its just going to get worse... Another Viet NAm I think
http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2003/06/24/ir ... iers030624

BAGHDAD - Six British soldiers were killed and eight others were wounded in two attacks in southern Iraq on Tuesday.


INDEPTH: Iraq

Both attacks occurred within a few kilometres of each other Tuesday near the southern city of Amarah, north of Basra.
The British government said the six soldiers killed were members of the Royal Military Police who were training local Iraqi police. They were apparently killed in an attack at a police station.

In the other incident, ground troops patrolling south of Amarah were ambushed by Iraqi rebels.

"The two vehicles in which they were travelling were attacked with rocket-propelled grenades and heavy machine guns and rifle fire from a large number of Iraqi gunmen. British troops returned fire and called for assistance from other U.K. forces," said Britain's defence secretary, Goeff Hoon.

The Chinook helicopter sent to assist the ground troops also came under fire as it landed. Eight members of the 1st Battalion of the Parachute Regiment in the helicopter were wounded, three of them seriously.

The Ministry of Defence said everyone on the helicopter was taken to a field hospital for treatment. The ministry said it was investigating whether the two attacks are related.

Hoon warned against jumping to conclusion about security in British-patrolled southern Iraq, but questions have been raised about their ability to maintain order.

Tam Dalyell of the ruling Labour party said the U.S.-led forces in Iraq are being perceived as an occupying army and the government to approach the UN for assistance.

Opposition members also called for Britain and the U.S. to get help from their allies.

"You've got almost daily attacks on U.S. forces, you've got pipelines being blown up and I think the danger now is we'll see more emboldened attacks by the Iraqi resistance and that could drag us into a long military campaign," said the Liberal Democrat foreign affairs spokesman, Paul Keech.

"If that happens, we're going to need the support of forces beyond our own forces in order to control that," he said.

That could be difficult politically because many of Britain's allies supported the invasion of Iraq in the first place.

At least 18 U.S. soldiers have been killed in Iraqi attacks since major combat ended on May 1.

Tuesday's attack is the first major attack on British troops since Baghdad fell to the U.S.-led invasion.

British soldiers have been in control of Basra, Iraq's second-largest city, for several weeks.



Written by CBC News Online staff

   

it's really too bad for the soldiers and thier families, but it just goes to show that you cannot ever let your guard down.

By the way RH, do you have any information on a disbanded Canadian unit called the 1rst Canadian guards. My father belonged to this unit from 1957 to 1969. I would really like to find some info for him.

   

http://www.regiments.org/milhist/na-can ... 953Gds.htm

This is what you are looking for buddy....
More info below





http://www.cgg.ca/

   

I do feel badly for the members of the military caught up in this, but from a political stand-point, what did they think was going to happen? Here's a piece for The Nation that points out some of the problems caused by the actions of troops in Iraq. http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20030707&s=bivens

   

Some very good points in that article Rev..

   

http://www.msnbc.com/news/870749.asp?vts=062520030930

Iraqi police says deadly attack
on soldiers provoked by British forces
MAJAR AL-KABIR, Iraq, June 25 — British forces gave civilian leaders in this town 48 hours to hand over gunmen who killed six military policemen after a violent demonstration that left four Iraqi civilians dead, a municipal official said Wednesday. Meantime, Iraqi police said that the killing occurred after the British troops shot to death four Iraqi civilians at an anti-coalition protest.
ARMED IRAQIS KILLED two of the British soldiers on Tuesday at the scene of the demonstration — in front of the mayor’s office — and then stormed a police station and killed four other British soldiers after a two-hour gunbattle, a pair of Iraqi policemen who were at the scene told the Associated Press.
The violent demonstration was the second in two days, apparently sparked by British soldiersÂ’ searches for heavy weapons in homes, said Abu Zahraa, a 30-year-old vendor.
“This angered the people because they went into women’s rooms,” Zahraa said. “The people considered it an invasion of privacy.”
British authorities gave conflicting accounts of the incident. British Prime Minister Tony Blair said Wednesday that “there had been problems” with British troops’ efforts to disarm the local populace, but a British military spokesman, Ronnie McCourt, said the killing of the military police officers was unprovoked murder.
A second incident on Tuesday also involved a fierce firefight between Iraqis and British troops occupying southern Iraq. That gunbattle wounded eight British soldiers, three of them seriously.
The violence had raised fears that attacks against coalition troops were spreading to previously calm areas, such as southern Iraq. Majar al-Kabir is a mostly Shiite city about 180 miles southeast of Baghdad and just south of the city of Amarah.

BRITISH REVIEW FORCE STRENGTH
They also sparked a review of BritainÂ’s forces in southern Iraq, with Defense Secretary Geoff Hoon saying Wednesday that Britain could send more soldiers to Iraq and require them to resume wearing helmets and body armor like their American counterparts.





“I know that there was some tension in this particular town,” he told British Broadcasting Corp. television. “That arises out of the fact that it is routinely the case in a number of these southern towns for people to be armed and indeed for people to have quite heavy weapons, including machine guns.”
He said an “urgent review” was under way and that reinforcements were ready if needed to ensure the safety of troops. “Depending on the results of that review ... we have significant forces available should it be necessary. Many thousands, certainly,” Hoon said.
Forty-two British troops have died — 19 in accidents — since the war began March 20. Until Tuesday, Britain had suffered no confirmed combat deaths since April 6.
British military officials were meeting with seven members of the cityÂ’s administrative council in the nearby town of Amarah, seeking the killersÂ’ surrender, said Qassem Nimeh, an official in the mayorÂ’s office in Majar al-Kabir.
Nimeh did not say whether they British had threatened to respond with force if the attackers were not handed over before the 48-hour deadline.



June 25 — Ambassador Paul Bremer, U.S. presidential envoy to Iraq, talks with “Today” show host Katie Couric about recent attacks on coalition forces and the rebuilding of Iraq.



“We hope that we’ll be able to bring those who are guilty of these attacks to justice,” L. Paul Bremer, the top U.S. official in Iraq, told reporters in Baghdad on Wednesday.

WITNESSESÂ’ ACCOUNTS
According to accounts from Iraqis in Majar al-Kabir, Tuesday’s violence began when British soldiers fired rubber bullets — and then live ammunition — at demonstrators in Majar al-Kabir who railed against the presence of British forces in the city, according to Zahraa, the vendor.
He said the British had formally agreed a day earlier to let local police patrol the city.
Accounts differed on where the four Iraqi civilians were killed. Some said British soldiers killed all four during the demonstration; another account said two unarmed protesters were killed during the demonstration and two other civilians were killed in the gunbattle at the police station.
After the deaths at the scene of the demonstration, angry townspeople fetched weapons from their homes, converged on the police station and attacked British soldiers, said Abbas Faddhel, an Iraqi policeman in the town.
One British soldier was shot and killed at the stationÂ’s doorway; the other three were slain after Iraqi gunmen stormed the station and cornered them in a single room, said Salam Mohammed, 30, member of a municipal security force.
Faddhel said that there were about two dozen Iraqi policemen at the station who fled through a window during the gunbattle. Two were wounded. Faddhel said the Iraqi police asked the British military police to flee with them but the British insisted on staying.
POLICE STATION BEARS BATTLE SCARS
On Wednesday, the station bore the marks of a large gunbattle, with walls full of bullet holes. Broken glass and dried blood stains covered the floor.
The mayorÂ’s office also showed signs of a siege, with grenade shrapnel in a bathroom and damage from an explosion on a sidewalk in front.
A British military spokesman, Capt. Adam Marchant-Wincott, said he could not confirm the Iraqi witness accounts. He said, however, that it was possible that there had been an agreement between British forces and local police allowing the locals to take over security for the city.
Marchant-Wincott said he could not say whether the British forces had fired at demonstrators but added that they would do so only if their lives were threatened.
In the second attack Tuesday, a “large number” of Iraqi gunmen opened fire on a British patrol near Majar al-Kabir with rocket-propelled grenades, heavy machine guns and rifles, said Hoon, the British defense minister. The British returned fire, and one British soldier was wounded in the fight.
A rapid reaction force, including Scimitar light tanks and a Chinook CH-47 helicopter, came to help the ground troops but also came under fire, Hoon said. Seven people on board the helicopter were wounded, the government said.
Hoon said commanders were investigating whether the attack was connected to the shootout at the police station.

ADMINISTRATOR DEFENDS PROGRESS
Bremer, the American administrator in Iraq, said Wednesday he would not be deterred by a “few fanatics” bent on wrecking peace efforts in Iraq and vowed his team would stay there until their job was done.
In interviews with U.S. television networks from Baghdad, he rejected criticism the United States had failed to secure postwar Iraq and said U.S. reconstruction plans were on target.



Attacks have mounted in recent days against U.S. and British troops in Iraq. Since May 1, when President Bush declared major combat over, 19 U.S. troops have died in hostile circumstances. On Tuesday, the U.S. military there had been 25 attacks on coalition forces over a 24-hour period, including a firefight in Ramadi, west of Baghdad, that killed four Iraqis and wounded two American soldiers and two Iraqis.
“Regrettable as these attacks are and it certainly is important for us to stop them, the fact of the matter is we are on program here,” Bremer said on NBC’s “Today” show. “We will proceed and we are not going to be deterred by a few fanatics.”
Bremer said it was unclear who was behind the latest attacks but he stressed most of Iraq was secure.

   

I think Tony Blair's goose will be cooked over this one. His popularity is going to suffer big-time. Not only does the British government seem to not be in control of things, they seem to be unable to even present a unified front to the press.

As things go sour for the US and Britain in and because of Iraq...no weapons of mass-destruction, demonstrations against their presence there, escalating violence by Iraqis against the occupying troops, poor economies at home, an increasingly hostile press and some serious-looking investigations starting in Britain...will the Bush and/or Blair governments start seriously looking another country to invade to take domestic minds off their troubles?

   

WAG THE DOG
Does that make anyone thing of something??

Wag the Dog (1997)

Directed by
Barry Levinson

Writing credits (WGA)
Larry Beinhart (book)
Hilary Henkin (I) (screenplay) ...
(more)

Genre: Comedy (more)

Tagline: A Hollywood producer. A Washington spin-doctor. When they get together, they can make you believe anything.

Plot Outline: Before elections, a spin-doctor and a Hollywood producer join efforts to "fabricate" a war in order to cover-up a presidential sex scandal.
http://www.imdb.com/Title?Wag+the+Dog+(1997)

   

SS still wants to bomb Hanoi! So there!

   

Soldiers die, especially when they're stupid enough to go to war. Maybe more of them will learn to chant, "Hell no! We won't go!" and other smart things.

   

Holy fuck, Fig! A soldier's job isn't to decide if "its" right or wrong, just do it!Besides that, has the "boo" club re-opened yet? I spent many hours/days/weeks in Belleville last year (summer) working, Kingston, Belleville, Trenton. Go find "crazy Frank's", across the street from the "boo"...., next door to "little Texas"!. Ask crazy Frank if the guy I punched in the face for calling me a "frenchman" because I lived in Ottawa got up yet! Hee, hee, ya can call call ABSOLUT a lot of things, but donna call him a frenchman!!!

   

YOU NEVER CEASE TO AMAZE ME WITH YOUR TOTAL LACK OF SMARTS SOMETIMES

   

Frenchwoman then???

   

It seems to me that right along about the end of Viet Nam era the soldiers were starting to decide, like Donovan said they should in his Universal Soldier song. A Hell of a lot of them decided the climate around here was kinda nice. Come to think of it, that is a good part of what caused the end of the Viet Nam era, lack of cannon fodder. It's a shame they all forgot the choice was theirs. I imagine they'll remember again in another 4 or 5 years, the ones that are still alive.

The Boo is still down. Fortunately we still have The Cabaret.

   

SUBLIMINAL MAN SAYS:? Fig, tune into 94 WHAT-THE- FUCK! Different time, different place!

   

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