Report stops short of blaming federalists

1st thing is that Jean Charest is cleared of any blame ! Therefore the controversy by the media should stop immediately.

And for you separatists out there, please look carefully at the fact that these authors are sovereignists.

Also, there were earlier reports that the ``OUI`` side also spent illegally, but it is funny that there is no mention of this by the extremely biased Quebec medias.

   

Yeah right he was only clear of any blame because the scope of the inquiry was too narrow. Don't worry the people understand very well how this inquiry work. Did you see how Grenier kept looking at his feet when he was answering question?

Citation de L'ex juge grenier lors de sa conférence de press du 29 mai 2007

Fort très fort cette comission! Pesonne n'est dupe et même si ça pue de sortire les vidanges l'été j'ai comme l'impression qu'on va le faire pareil! en crissant Charest et sa gagne de tricheurs aux chemins.

   

Bon... comme d'habitude, les péquistes ne veulent pas rien savoir ce qui n'est pas selon leur opinions.

Je vais te faire lire un petit quelque chose.

Prends le temps de le lire bien comme il faut. Tu vas voir qu'il y a un scandale du coté du ``OUI`` mais les médias Québecois ne veulent ou n'osent pas en parler. Encore une fois, c'est un bon example de la propagande des medias au Québec. Mais, peu importe, voici un article qui ose voir les choses autrement.

Amuses-toi à lire

   

Désoler mon chère mais ont va sortire les vidanges cet été!

   

Encore une fois, une bonne petite tactique péquiste. Lorsque le sujet ne vous convient pas. Éviter de répondre tout simplement.

Oublie pas de faire sortir plutôt la grosse vache Marois. Elle serait pourtant bien dans le champ à se rouler dans le fumier avec les porcs. Elle serait dans son élément.

En tout cas, il n'y aura pas d'élections cet été ti-gars. Les Libéraux sont présentement en négo avec les péquistes. En passant, si tu peux répondre à ceci. Pourquoi est-ce que les péquistes (et médias péquistes) écoeuraient Charest lorsqu'il n'avait pas baissé les impôts depuis 2003. Pis maintenant, ils critiquent encore le PLQ pour vouloir une baisse d'impôt. C'est quoi que vous voulez tabarnak. Decidez vous !!!

   

C'est très simple à comprendre. Patapouif c'est fait élire en 2003 en fesant coire au monde qu'il allait faire ce qu'il à promis. c'est ça qu'on lui reproche! c'est pourtant évident. Un politicien comme Charest est près à dire n'importe quoi pour ce faire élire comprend-tu?

Maintenant le problème c'est qu'il finance une baisse d'impôt en créant un déficit permanent pour les années avenir. Franchement c'est tellement irresponsable que même l'ADQ est pas capable d'appuyer cela.

Mais bon Patapouf est près à le faire pareil parce que pour lui c'est plus important d'être réelue que de mettre nos enfants dans la marde!

   

HéHéHé. Des politiciens aussi comme:

René Levesque
Pierre Marc Johnson
Jacques Parizeau
Lucien Bouchard
Bernard Landry



Selon toé, des baisses d'impôt c'est pas important. On est la province la plus taxée en Amerique du Nord. La solution pour les péquistes est d'augmenter les taxes pour payer les BS pis remplir les poches des fonctionnaires. Sans compter, créer des programmes sociaux inutiles. Pis mettre de l'argent dans les mains des syndicalistes.

Envoyer les Quebecois!!! Payons des taxes, de toute facon, on est habitué tabarnak!

Pis la grosse vache Pauline Marois a endetter le Quebec pendant des années. C'est pour ca que le PLQ ne pouvait pas réduire les impôts avant. Charest, depuis 2003, a fait beaucoup d'améloration avec le trou que le gouvernement péquiste précédent avait laissé les affaires. Maintenant, il est en mesure de réduire les impôts pis, comme d'habitude, l'opposition chiale. Les péquistes chialent tout le temps, alors cela n'est pas nouveau.

   

Ben oui ben oui AKZ Lâche pas

   

AKZ : Sur le sujet des baisses d'impôts... j'avoues qu'il y a quelque chose que je trouve franchement hilarant : Charest promettait des baisses d'impôts, mais quand il a atteind le pouvoir, il disait qu'on avait pas assez d'argent. Maintenant il croit qu'on en a assez, mais il a réussi à convaincre tout le monde que ce n'est pas le cas et personne n'en veut plus.

Bon! Moi à la base j'ai toujours été contre, mais je n'aime pas non plus les politiciens qui mentent et qui ignorent la population, donc alors qu'il aurait pu se tirer de l'histoire des impôts avec un "clean sheet" dans mon opinion, il se retrouve avec un beau -2. Mais peu importe, revenons au vrai sujet.

Bien que 500 000$ soit loin du 5M$ allégé par Normand Lester et Robin Philpot (ce qui en soit ne constitue pas une surprise, ils sont bien trop biaisés), les plus vocaux fédéralistes semblent déjà presque s'amuser aux dépends des souverainistes car ils ont volé moins que prévu...

"Eille le cave, j't'ai pas volé 500$! Juste 100$. Chu innocent, 'sti!"

Bon. C'est mieux moins que plus. Mais je vois certains journalistes fédéralistes (une espèce rare, je l'admet), plusieurs wannabe-analyste-politique dans les sections "opinions" des bulletins radios et télévisés ainsi que certains députés et ministres Libéraux agir comme si 500 000$ dépensés illégalement, eh bien on s'en crisse parce que c'est moins que prévu et que donc c'est comme si c'était 0$. Ça, c'est une attitude que je trouve d'autant plus désolante que les allégations exagérées de Philpot et Lester (à moins qu'Elvis ait raison et que les chiffres ont seulement été réduits par le manque de pouvoir du juge Grenier, qui ne pouvait enquêter autant qu'il l'aurait voulu).

En gros, pour une rare fois dans ma vie, je suis presque entièrement d'accord avec Stéphane Dion : si on veut vraiment savoir tout sur les fraudes ayant affecté le référendum de 1995, il faudrait faire une grande et neutre étude fédérale-provinciale sur les camps du Oui et du Non, et ce en même temps et par les mêmes personnes, et non pas séparément ni avec des méthodes différentes.

   

At least, my posts consist of a constructive argument. Unlike yours Elvis, which you avoid the subject at all costs, probably because you don't want to admit that the ``OUI`` side is also to blame. Typical péquiste.

Anyways, for those of you which cannot read French, here is a little explanation on the thread at hand.

Option Canada, created to battle for federalism in Quebec’s 1995 sovereignty referendum, illegally spent $539,460 during the official campaign, an inquiry into allegations of illegal spending by the No side reported yesterday.

But that’s a long way from the more than $5.2 million alleged to have been illegally disbursed in the first place. And it led Premier Jean Charest, who was vice-president of the No committee in 1995, to yesterday dismiss the potentially explosive report as a “wet firecracker.”

Also, there are alleged accusations the ``YES`` side also spent illegally. But it seems as though the biased medias here in QC are trying to keep it hush hush. After all, it would particularly damaging to the PQ. They will pretty much do anything to keep Charest out of power. They are creating a contraversy where there should not be any at all.

   

(I'll write in English since the thread took that turn for now)

I have to disagree, AKZ, this controversy is not a "fake" one created by the media by any means. Money was stolen, and it was first believed to be a LOT, hence why it got so much media attention - we can't just say that because the amount of cash was far lesser than expected, the medias should have saw it coming and shut up! Plus, it's not so the amount of money stolen that matters but rather the crime itself - if everyone just ignored it, what kind of message would we be sending? That it's alright to cheat if one arbitrarily decides an issue is too important for a possible loss to be acceptable, even if said eventual loss would come from a democratic proccess?

The medias in Quebec tend to be pro-PQ, yes, but the tendency is small. Yet you show it as if we lived under a Venezuelan-like regime under which the media have to follow the will of a party (I won't say government since it wouldn't fit at all, but you get my point). That is far from reality! Also note that there also are many medias which disagree heavily with the PQ. English newspapers from Montreal are decidedly anti-PQ, and often very probably much too lenient towards the Liberals. Both Opinion Radio stations in Quebec City are openly anti-PQ and one is openly pro-ADQ, and these stations hold nearly as much power than the televised media (and more than written media) in the region. Comparing the slight bias of traditionnal media to that of those radio stations would be like comparing a slingshot to a machine gun. The only thing that downplays these stations's influence is their regional nature.

As for the allegations against the Yes side, it's very likely they also spent illegally, but not enough proof has been gathered up to now to lead to an investigation. The same could be said for the No side until very recently - remember it took a decade before the allegations against the No side became serious enough to be investigated. The same may or may not happen to the Yes side, if similar events are repeated.

   

There is probably a reason why there is not enough proof to make any allegations towards the ``Yes`` side. As mentioned earlier, Philpot and Lester, both have sovereignist affiliations. As you may already know, the medias decide which contraversy to create and which to keep a lid on. And that is where the problem is. I have shown a French article in an earlier post. It clearly shows the spending done while Parizeau was with the referendum organization.

At least, you seem to show some impartiality. Although, it may seem as though a little to the PQ. But it's alright.

Also, good post when you mention that there should be the same recognition for the ``YES`` as there was for the ``NO`` side. As Dion stated, it should be fair for both. There is the problem. The medias only seem to show contraversy towards the PLQ but, again, keep hush-hush when it comes to allegations for the sovereignists side.

   

Good point that the media choose which controversies to bring up. It's certainly possible to bring the point up in the media if the allegations against the Yes side are serious enough, though, even if it may requires a little bit more effort. Perhaps there just needs to be another Philpot and another Lester, except that they'd side against the Yes side this time. IMO though, there's two things all Québécois, and by extension all Canadians, should do : either forget the past, prevent any doubtful move to happen again if the circumstances arise and move on, either go under a massive investigation like Dion proposed and finally get over all the fraud that could have happened during the referendum, regardless of the side (although I'm fairly certain we'd just realize both sides frauded just as much).

   

All you have to do is look at Quebecor Media. That includes TVA along with newpapers. Btw, this is only intended to be shown as an exemple. Claude Charron, Paul Laroque and Lise Payette for the Journal de Quebec and so on... Although, I must admit that there is a French Federalist newspaper which is La Presse. Not in Quebec City but nonetheless. At least it brings a side to counter the PQ biased medias.

Also, at least you seem to make it into a constructive argument, unlike Elvis, when brought up with facts, simply avoids the subject all together. Only look at the previous posts in this thread. That clearly shows lack of maturity, but then again, it is typical for separatists. And I should know since I have some friends, when faced with facts, choose to avoid talking about the issues. People need to realize that there is always two side to a story. Also, the news here in Quebec are very influential. Well, then, the news organization should show more neutrality upon presenting a story. Instead, they choose to bash Charest with all they can while presenting Pauline Marois with such inspiration. Charest, at least stood up to unions and should be applauded for that. Another thing, is that unions are very strong in this province, therefore, medias will side with them most of the time, whether right or not.


As far as the radio stations. Choi Radio X rocks Man oh man, there is finally a radio station which seem to tell it like it is. Whatever stories they come up with, at least, they can back it up. Used to love it when Jeff Fillion was in the morning broadcast. Although, the guys presently there now are also good. They seem to dare talk about which the mainstream media is opposed. They can be pro-ADQ or anything else, no matter, here are a bunch of people that make sense.

   

I like your example concerning the image of Marois compared to that of Charest's in the medias - I wonder how Couillard will be treated if he ever comes to the PLQ leadership. I really like him, he's one of the few politicians I'd feel genuinely comfortable with even if he got to a position of power.

I won't talk of Choi FM since it could break the nice atmosphere this thread has come to, but I'll point out I'm 100% with you when you imply Quebecor Media is crap. Their sensationalist attitude annoys me just so much. If only they didn't dominate the airwaves, and especially newspapers, so much... I have to stick to SRC and TV5 for televised news (TV5 because it gives the important international news and doesn't get me all fired up by local nonsense) and Le Soleil as newspaper (I like them, but even a convinced leftist such as me realizes they're really sold to the left). Maybe one day I'll be willing to add TQS to that, but not before they drop their own sensationalist behavior.