Ancient text has Jesus referring to 'my wife'
ShepherdsDog @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:42 pm
http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story ... pyrus.html
Was this the part where he prophesied my wife would be calling out God's name three or four nights a week?
On a serious note, who the hell cares if he was married. it already says in 2 Timothy that a religion that imposes celibacy on its followers is a false religion.
$1:
1 Timothy 4,
4 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils,
2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their conscience seared with a hot iron,
3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.
4 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils,
2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their conscience seared with a hot iron,
3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.
1 Timothy 3 says bishops and deacons must be good husbands(one wife only) and fathers. How well they ran their households was supposed to demonstrate how well they could run others under their charge.
$1:
3 This is a true saying: If a man desire the office of bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt at teaching;
3 not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for filthy lucre, but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 one who ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all dignity.
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 He must not be a novice in the faith, lest being lifted up with pride, he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good reputation with those who are outsiders, lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be serious, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy for filthy lucre,
9 holding the mystery of the faith with a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then, being found blameless, let them make use of the office of a deacon.
11 So also must their wives be serious, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let each deacon be the husband of one wife, ruling his children and his own house well.
13 For those who have ministered the office of deacon well purchase for themselves a good standing and great boldness in the faith, which is in Christ Jesus.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt at teaching;
3 not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for filthy lucre, but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 one who ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all dignity.
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 He must not be a novice in the faith, lest being lifted up with pride, he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good reputation with those who are outsiders, lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Likewise must the deacons be serious, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy for filthy lucre,
9 holding the mystery of the faith with a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then, being found blameless, let them make use of the office of a deacon.
11 So also must their wives be serious, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.
12 Let each deacon be the husband of one wife, ruling his children and his own house well.
13 For those who have ministered the office of deacon well purchase for themselves a good standing and great boldness in the faith, which is in Christ Jesus.
So what if he was married?
jeff744 @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:44 pm
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story/2012/09/18/jesus-wife-papyrus.html
Was this the part where he prophesied my wife would be calling out God's name three or four nights a week?
On a serious note, who the hell cares if he was married. it already says in 2 Timothy that a religion that imposes celibacy on its followers is a false religion. 1 Timothy 4, and 1 Timothy 3 says bishops and deacons must be good husbands(one wife only) and fathers, setting how they run their household as an example of how well they can run a Church.
Was this the part where he prophesied my wife would be calling out God's name three or four nights a week?
On a serious note, who the hell cares if he was married. it already says in 2 Timothy that a religion that imposes celibacy on its followers is a false religion. 1 Timothy 4, and 1 Timothy 3 says bishops and deacons must be good husbands(one wife only) and fathers, setting how they run their household as an example of how well they can run a Church.
Only importance is trying to make it so higher up Catholics can finally take wives again (as they did for centuries, even when it was against the rules for quite some time)
Zipperfish @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:54 pm
The behaviour of Mary Magdelene has led some scholars to believ that he was married. Also, apparently he was a rabbi and rabbis were supposed to be married.
ShepherdsDog @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:07 pm
The catholic hierarchy also wanted to make sure that when a wealthy cleric died, all his wealth went to the Church, rather than children. When celibacy started to be seriously enforced in the 12th century(up until then clerical marriage was ignored for the most part)Roman Catholic Church, many younger sons of nobles went into the Church as well as their lands and wealth. The Orthodox only apply celibacy on those who enter the priesthood single, are divorced or widowed.
It's interesting that married clergy who return to the Roman Church, mostly Anglicans, are allowed to remain married.....and some African Catholic congregations allow for clerical marriage. even today. A friend of mine, who is a Dominican priest, thinks it should all be a matter of personal choice....pretty sure what his choice would be.
Zipperfish @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:11 pm
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
The catholic hierarchy also wanted to make sure that when a wealthy cleric died, all his wealth went to the Church, rather than children.
Ahhhhh sooooo. That maes sense.
CanadianJeff @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:47 pm
If you look at how the new testament was put together there are a ton more of these books out there somewhere and many of them may hold things just as shocking.
Seriously when they selected which gospels to put in the new testament it came down to a vote out of dozens of choices. Seriously the 4 gospels picked were the result of a vote.
EyeBrock @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:52 pm
Blessed are the Cheesemakers.
ShepherdsDog @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:55 pm
The 'New Testament' has been selectively written, rewritten, edited and reedited and revised from the beginning...whole epistles and books were tossed over the centuries. Add to that translating it from the original Greek(and a bit of Aramaic), as that was the predominant language of the region, and the language, of culture into Latin and then into English
EyeBrock @ Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:57 pm
I think those books may be edited a tad too.
sandorski @ Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:59 am
What if Jesus was just some Roman Al Bundy?
BartSimpson @ Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:12 pm
Zipperfish Zipperfish:
The behaviour of Mary Magdelene has led some scholars to believe that he was married. Also, apparently he was a rabbi and rabbis were supposed to be married.
Exactly. Jesus spoke to the Pharisees and was a member of the Sanhedrin. The Sanhedrin was for married men only and the Pharisees would not have spoken to Jesus absent His gravitas as a member of the Sanhedrin.
In the context of His time, had Jesus NOT been married it would have been so remarkable as to have required mention in the Gospels. That the Gospels are silent on this is the sure indication that Jesus was married to a woman named 'Brenda'.
In which case it's perfectly understandable why He wanted to be crucified.
BartSimpson @ Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:15 pm
EyeBrock EyeBrock:
I think those books may be edited a tad too.
Not really. Scholars have asked this question before and the fact of the matter is that while the various translations of the modern Bible may interpret their translations differently, the text closely adheres to the oldest known documents and letters such as those found in the Dead Sea Scrolls and the more recent find of scrolls in Egypt.
Brenda @ Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:20 pm
BartSimpson BartSimpson:
That the Gospels are silent on this is the sure indication that Jesus was married to a woman named 'Brenda'.
In which case it's perfectly understandable why He wanted to be crucified.
In which case it's perfectly understandable why He wanted to be crucified.
Awwww, Jesus, I love you too
BartSimpson @ Wed Sep 19, 2012 1:54 pm
Brenda Brenda:
BartSimpson BartSimpson:
That the Gospels are silent on this is the sure indication that Jesus was married to a woman named 'Brenda'.
In which case it's perfectly understandable why He wanted to be crucified.
In which case it's perfectly understandable why He wanted to be crucified.
Awwww, Jesus, I love you too
![[BB]](./images/smilies/beers.gif "Beers")
meagan @ Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:27 am
$1:
a religion that imposes celibacy on its followers is a false religion
You got that right. And Jesus was Not a member of the Sanhedrin. He was persecuted by the Sanhedrin because they were afraid of him accumulating followers and taking thier power away from them.