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That's the best you got?

Weak sauce.

Alberta is already assuming the bulk of the risk, no we just need to figure out how to get the rest of you out of the profits.

   

Nope, I wasn't. I like discussion. I was just curious, as to people's motivations. Part of the whole 'discussion' thing. I was just seeing a trend, and wondered 'why?'. Why do we never see discussions on Saskatchewan's or Newfoundlands' ever increasing economic clout? Why do we never discuss the Naval ship contracts the east and west coasts were supposed to have?

I think you hit the nail on the head Andy, "schadenfreude". People like to discuss Albertas percieved failings instead of ways to improve Canada, because they enjoy revelling in our failure. Guess what? It gets real old, real fast.



Good luck with that!

   

It's easy to cut out the ROC. Separate.

Or hang around a website and complain...

   

Do we not have some responsibility in this?

Are we, Joe Public, not the costumer demanding more and cheaper oil?

There wouldn't be a pipeline to leak, or a tanker to spill, if we weren't demanding the product.

Not to mention that every aspect of a pipeline has to signed off and inspected by the government, as well as yearly inspection reviews to ensure compliance and maintenance, but...

We all just want the reward none of the risk or responsibility.

   

Maybe you should take a break and get some better zingers?

I see you still have nothing to say about receiving reward with Alberta's risk.

Why am I not surprised.

   

I believe it was YOU who brought up the whole "interconnected" argument - I just responded to it.

Be that as it may - Dr. C was right.

This issue matters not one iota to you or anyone else outside our province. Our lack of a sales tax or flat income tax doesn't really affect you - other than possibly luring away people and companies looking to keep a little more of their own money in their own pocket.

Then again, I suppose the whole oil pipeline issue might matter to your province (and others one day) - because if that slot machine stops paying out, it'll be be your province (and maybe Ontario) that'll be among those asked to pick up the tab.

Some days, I can't wait for the days of peak oil - all these environmentalists who hate the oilsands, pipelines, etc (and the wealth it creates) we want to build can either freeze or starve, while we can go on living in 21st century.

Personally, I don't mind slightly higher taxes (and/or health care premiums) if it means keeping the level of service we have here.

   

I don't think there are too many members of the public demadning for cheper oil and damn the consequences to the environment or human health(ok maybe in Alberta ). Cetainly we are not asking them to take risks with the environment and health in order to maximize their own profits.

I think for the most part we are asking them to provide us oil with a reasonable level of responsiblity, and they claim to be doing that. Since Joe Public is not an oil expert we have to take their word and the word of the government since we can't verify these claims ourselves. Then sometthing bad happens and we learn that all companies are liars and the government is in their pocket.

   

I would have no issues with Alberta rolling out a 10% HST (5% PST, 5% GST), if only our government used the money appropriately.

The biggest problem I have stomaching increased taxes is that the Alberta government can't fully explain why they are already spending more per capita than most provinces for lesser services.

Why pay more when we already receive less?

   

Funny (and I mean this in general, not to you BF), Walmart decimated many doing exactly what you say people didn't want.

And Walmart is just the easy example, the 'cheaper mentality' pervades every single industry. Ever here of the tender system? It is how almost all large scale business is done. It is founded on cheapest equal.

Consumer only seem to give a rats when something bad effects them directly.



This is the ideal, yet we (in Alberta) keep electing the same monkeys into power. Which is basically stating to the oil companies and the government that we approve of the status quo.

   

You sure about that? It seems like every time gas prices spike, there is much wailing and moaning coast to coast about it.

   

The thing is we pay way less in taxes than any other province in Canada - the reason we have the ability to spend more is because of our oil industry. If we didn't have it, then we'd probably spend far less than most other provinces - or have higher taxes than we do now (the government largely uses it as a crutch to keep taxes low). Both Saskatchewan and BC collect much more per capita in taxes than we do (BC is almost twice our tax collection per capita).

For the record, I don't think we do get less - sure some provinces may have a shorter waiting list for this procedure or that one, and another province might have a better education system, but I'd argue that's largely a matter of priorities here in Alberta. Why bother investing in post-secondary when lots of people just finish high school and then go into the patch and drive a hotshot truck or work on a rig?

I'd also argue that with our province growing much faster than most other provinces AND due to our lack of infrastructure spending in the 90s, we have a huge deficit of infrastructure that needs work. Tack on things like higher wages for medical staff in Alberta, lower corporate tax rates, etc, and you get a death by a 1000 cuts.

   

When they give me gas for free, I'll consider your proposal. As long as they are the ones making the profits while I pay, I say the risk belongs with polluter. Of course if them assuming the true risk raises prices on the product, I'll still pay. But I'm OK with that.

   

I brought up interconnectedness when Calep was questioning why Beaver was posting this. YOU then shifted the discussion to oil pipelines. You could have easily just stayed with why Alberta's financial position is of interest to people outside of Alberta, no no, YOU had to go for the pipeline.

BTW, we also have discussions about the financial pic of other provinces on this board. Quebec for sure, and if New Brunswick all of a sudden becomes a have province or something, there'd be lots of go round about that.

   

Are you sure you want the risk to belong to the polluter?

Better be 100% on that!

Now, go look up who the biggest polluters are....

Us, Joe Public.

As for not profiting from the oil, well then, maybe we should deduct all of that government revenue received from the oil industry...you know, the stuff that subsidizes our healthcare, education, police forces...the little things that let us live nice, comfortable lives in Canada.

   

This is all irrelevant. Government revenue is government revenue. If we get ours through oil royalties and they get theirs through taxes makes little difference to the government.

It doesn't strike you as odd that the Alberta government has one of (if not) the highest revenue per capita, but can't offer all the luxuries?

Where is the money going? Why do we have an infrastructure debt? Or a better question, why did we need to go into an infrastructure debt to pay off our fiscal debt?

The way I see it, with the amount of money that the Alberta government is getting, they better be providing better than 'par with everybody else'. If they want to provide 'on par' I want them to reduce taxes until they have 'on par' revenue.

   

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