Torture Inc. Americas Brutal Prisons
Jackass @ Wed Apr 27, 2005 1:29 pm
michaelredeagle michaelredeagle:
http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_1372461.html?menu=news.quirkies.strangecrime
Funny enough to you realize that these so called hardened criminals had not yet been judged or found guilty, these were not guys in prison but people who had just gotten arrested and were supposedly "innocent until proven guilty". How would you like to have a misunderstanding and end up in there, only to be found innocent but still treated this way? In that state, 60% of those in court are found innocent...
http://pfadp.org/raphillips.html
http://www.freep.com/entertainment/news ... 040222.htm
Funny enough to you realize that these so called hardened criminals had not yet been judged or found guilty, these were not guys in prison but people who had just gotten arrested and were supposedly "innocent until proven guilty". How would you like to have a misunderstanding and end up in there, only to be found innocent but still treated this way? In that state, 60% of those in court are found innocent...
http://pfadp.org/raphillips.html
http://www.freep.com/entertainment/news ... 040222.htm
Nope i believe innocent until proven guilty it is disturbinbg that people who are arrested and awaiting trial are thrown into maximum security prisons with the hardened creiminals. I would be all for changing that.
sk1d @ Wed Apr 27, 2005 3:30 pm
i know the government doesn't want to make this stuff widely known because of embarrassment, but don't you think if people knew about all of this shit, plus what the prisoners do to each other that it could help as a deterrent to crime?
flyman01 @ Wed Apr 27, 2005 3:33 pm
NO just like the death penalty , it would prove to not work as a sucessful deterent. Criminals will still act on impluses.
sk1d @ Wed Apr 27, 2005 3:39 pm
most people know that the death penalty is not for someone who holds up a liquor store or steals a car, but for those crimes they will go to jail and all of these things could happen to them like getting beaten up by guards, getting ass raped by another inmate or 'accidently' being restrained the wrong way and dying
Constantinople @ Wed Apr 27, 2005 3:39 pm
I think this is what comes with such an open democracy. People are given so much freedom that the bad ones have too much and need to be put in the slammer. On the flipside, it works very well for people who are good.
Scape @ Thu Apr 28, 2005 11:30 pm
Here is food for thought: [url=http://www.ilmjp.com/us_prison_empire.htm]From 1965 to 1975,
the US prison population actually shrank at the rate of about 1% per year.1
The drug war especially against cannabis changed all that, and turned
the failing prison industry into a booming business. US Bureau of Justice
Statistics show that at the beginning of the Reagan era in 1980, there were
220 inmates for every 100,000 people in the US. But by the end of the Reagan
era in 1989, prisons were stuffed to maximum capacityŠ bursting at a record
434 inmates per 100,000 US citizens. During the Reagan era, the number of
inmates per 100,000 US citizens had risen by 214 over a 9 year periodŠ when
it had only risen 80 per 100,000 over the previous 52 years!
The trend continues today with over 690 inmates per 100,000 US citizens,2 or
over 2 million behind bars in the year 2000.3 The rate of imprisonment in
the US is more than 7 times higher than any other western country.[/url]
Wow, that's an explosion.
Jackass @ Thu Apr 28, 2005 11:41 pm
sk1d sk1d:
most people know that the death penalty is not for someone who holds up a liquor store or steals a car, but for those crimes they will go to jail and all of these things could happen to them like getting beaten up by guards, getting ass raped by another inmate or 'accidently' being restrained the wrong way and dying
Yes i think that acts as a deterrent. Certain criminals will do the crime regardless of what deterrents are out there but for a large majority of petty criminals I think the poor treatment of inmates can be a deterrent
canucker @ Fri Apr 29, 2005 12:22 am
Prisons in the States desperately need more funding from the government. They are not equipped to house such an increase in prison population. They are overcrowded and understaffed.
That, of course, does not justify what happened to the immates that were tortured.
michaelredeagle @ Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:12 am
America is diffinately #1 in prison states. One fence down, one to go.
When I was in arizona the two jokes were that they were just going to put a fence around the whole state (#1 industry in az is prisons). And of course:
Arizona: Come on vacation, leave on probation, return on violation. I've seen them selling the bumperstickers all over the state.
Scape @ Sat Apr 30, 2005 12:46 am
U.S. Prison Population Soars in 2003, '04
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An estimated 12.6 percent of all black men in their late 20s were in jails or prisons, as were 3.6 percent of Hispanic men and 1.7 percent of white men in that age group
After sharp increases in the 1980s and 1990s, the incarceration rate has recently grown at a slower pace.
Direct expenditure for each of the major criminal justice functions (police, corrections, judicial) has been increasing.
With an inflation of around 265% for the period, this means that police and justice budgets were flat or growing very slightly, the corrections budget doubled in real terms, and the prison population tripled. (of course, the Dow Jones was multiplied by 16 during the period)
It's also interesting to note that this is a fairly recent trend:
The result is that the US now have the highest incarceration rate in the world, by very far if compared to other Western countries (2002 numbers):
The Sentencing Project
Note also that with 2.1 million people in jail (and another 5 million under the control of the penal system), most of them of working age, the US unemployment rate is artificially lowered by at least 1.5 points (if not 5 points, depending on how you evaluate the employment prospects of ex convicts or people on probation).
Abu Ghraib .... Shocking? What Happened There Is Commonplace at U.S. Prisons
$1:
in the typical American prison, designed and run to maximize degradation, brutalization, and punishment, overt torture is the norm. Beatings, electric shock, prolonged exposure to heat and even immersion in scalding water, sodomy with riot batons, nightsticks, flashlights, and broom handles, shackled prisoners forced to lie in their own excrement for hours or even days, months of solitary confinement, rape and murder by guards or prisoners instructed by guards--all are everyday occurrences in the American prison system.
The use of sex and sexual humiliation as torture in Abu Ghraib and the other American prisons in Iraq is endemic to the American prison. Psychological and physical sexual torture is exacerbated by the underlying policy of denying prisoners any volitional sex, making the only two forms of sexual activity that are physically possible--homosexuality and masturbation--both offenses subject to punishment. Strip searches, including invasive and often intentionally painful examination of the mouth, anus, testicles or vagina, frequently accompanied by verbal or physical sexual abuse, are part of the daily routine in most prisons. A 1999 Amnesty International report documented the commonplace rape of prisoners by guards in women's prisons.[2]
Each year, numerous prisoners are maimed, crippled, and even killed by guards. Photographs could be taken on any day in the American prison system that would match the photographs from Abu Ghraib that shocked the public
The use of sex and sexual humiliation as torture in Abu Ghraib and the other American prisons in Iraq is endemic to the American prison. Psychological and physical sexual torture is exacerbated by the underlying policy of denying prisoners any volitional sex, making the only two forms of sexual activity that are physically possible--homosexuality and masturbation--both offenses subject to punishment. Strip searches, including invasive and often intentionally painful examination of the mouth, anus, testicles or vagina, frequently accompanied by verbal or physical sexual abuse, are part of the daily routine in most prisons. A 1999 Amnesty International report documented the commonplace rape of prisoners by guards in women's prisons.[2]
Each year, numerous prisoners are maimed, crippled, and even killed by guards. Photographs could be taken on any day in the American prison system that would match the photographs from Abu Ghraib that shocked the public
Some US Prisons As Bad As Abu Ghraib
Prisoner Abuse: How Different are U.S. Prisons? (Human Rights Watch)
Abu Ghraib, USA
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When I first saw the photo, taken at the Abu Ghraib prison, of a hooded and robed figure strung with electrical wiring, I thought of the Sacramento, California, city jail.
When I heard that dogs had been used to intimidate and bite at least one detainee at Abu Ghraib, I thought of the training video shown at the Brazoria County Detention Center in Texas.
When I learned that the male inmates at Abu Ghraib were forced to wear women's underwear, I thought of the Maricopa County jails in Phoenix, Arizona.
And when I saw the photos of the naked bodies restrained in grotesque and clearly uncomfortable positions, I thought of the Utah prison system.
Donald Rumsfeld said of the abuse when he visited Abu Ghraib on May 13, "It doesn't represent American values."
But the images from Iraq looked all too American to me.
I've been reporting on abuse and mistreatment in our nation's jails and prisons for the last eight years. What I have found is widespread disregard for human rights. Sadism, in some locations, is casual and almost routine.
Reporters and commentators keep asking, how could this happen? My question is, why are we surprised when many of these same practices are occurring at home?
When I heard that dogs had been used to intimidate and bite at least one detainee at Abu Ghraib, I thought of the training video shown at the Brazoria County Detention Center in Texas.
When I learned that the male inmates at Abu Ghraib were forced to wear women's underwear, I thought of the Maricopa County jails in Phoenix, Arizona.
And when I saw the photos of the naked bodies restrained in grotesque and clearly uncomfortable positions, I thought of the Utah prison system.
Donald Rumsfeld said of the abuse when he visited Abu Ghraib on May 13, "It doesn't represent American values."
But the images from Iraq looked all too American to me.
I've been reporting on abuse and mistreatment in our nation's jails and prisons for the last eight years. What I have found is widespread disregard for human rights. Sadism, in some locations, is casual and almost routine.
Reporters and commentators keep asking, how could this happen? My question is, why are we surprised when many of these same practices are occurring at home?
A Visit to Valley State Prison for Women
Recommendations to address human rights violations in the USA (Amnesty, 2004)
A Simple Way to Fight H.I.V. and AIDS
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In any given year, perhaps a third of the people infected with hepatitis C and more than 15 percent of those with AIDS spend time behind bars. With infection levels far higher than in the outside world, the jails and prisons are a potential public health menace. Officials have a special duty to curb the spread of disease among the more than 11 million people who pass through the system each year.
No one knows for sure how many people pick up H.I.V. while incarcerated. But a 2002 survey of prisoners' own estimates found that about 44 percent of the inmates were probably participating in sex acts. Researchers suspect that about 70 percent had their first same-sex experiences in prison. If those estimates are anywhere near accurate, the risk of infection behind bars is substantial, and the men who contract H.I.V. in prison return home to infect wives and girlfriends. Still, condoms are barred or unavailable in 95 percent of the country's prisons.
No one knows for sure how many people pick up H.I.V. while incarcerated. But a 2002 survey of prisoners' own estimates found that about 44 percent of the inmates were probably participating in sex acts. Researchers suspect that about 70 percent had their first same-sex experiences in prison. If those estimates are anywhere near accurate, the risk of infection behind bars is substantial, and the men who contract H.I.V. in prison return home to infect wives and girlfriends. Still, condoms are barred or unavailable in 95 percent of the country's prisons.
BartSimpson @ Tue May 03, 2005 12:49 pm
The US has a lot of people in prison. True. China has more people in prison camps and restricted to cities where they are not allowed to travel. Essentially, these entire cities are prisons. China also executes more people EACH MONTH than the US executed in the latter half of the 20th Century. And they are PROUD of this. China's defacto prison population according to different sites hovers in the hundreds of millions.
Cuba is one big prison. Unless someone wants to tell me how 'free' they are.
Here's a site with supporting info: http://www.straightdope.com/columns/040206.html
And the prison industry is waaaaaay out of control in the US. But outside of the prisons we have no deterrents to crime. The major cities impose gun control which allows criminals to act with impunity so the public calls for harsher sentencing. In the states where gun control has been severely reduced crime has fallen and the prison populations have followed suit.
Criminals prefer unarmed victims, you see.
Canada, while having gun control, deters violent crime by classing such crimes as terrorism and then lettiing the military handle them. And who the heck wants to stare down the paras? They do NOT negotiate. Ergo, very little violent crime. The US civil rights groups would SCREAM if the US implemented the highly effective Canadian crime deterring tactics.
Also, Canada has been a mostly homogenous society while the US has absorbed immigrants in such numbers that many US cities are becoming Balkanized with population figures comparable to the actual Balkans! The Mexicans have a very violent "macho" culture (whose roots are Aztec and not Spanish in origin) that lends itself to violent acts and the blacks have a persistent subculture of violence and lawlessness that they pride themselves on. The blacks disparage their fellows who assimilate and succeed in normal society while lionizing pimps, drug dealers, gang bangers, and welfare cheats. Basketball players are lionized for ill-behavior while baseball players, who tend to be more genteel, are ignored in the black subculture. There are also very small Asian groups in which they behave with even more intense violence than either the Mexicans or the blacks. Asians, for the most part, though, are far more socially responsible than any other demographic group.
In the US South the "redneck" subculture still lends itself to horrific behaviors and perversions and while minorities predominate in southern state prison populations it is still the Caucasians who commit the crimes that make world news.
To quote a comedian: "A gang-banger will shoot you but a hillbilly will KEEP you!"
The rednecks do scary shit.
In states where there is a homogenous majority (as in Canada) the crime rates are low and the prison populations reflect that.
New Hampshire, Vermont, Idaho, and Wyoming would be those states with demographically homogenous populations.
I'm all for implementing Canadian crime control policies but you folks will have to deal with the fact that the major US cities would be killing fields while the military cleans them up.
Zipperfish @ Tue May 03, 2005 1:31 pm
$1:
China has more people in prison camps and restricted to cities where they are not allowed to travel
It's not exactly a heartening rallying cry "Hey, we're not as bad as China!"
BartSimpson @ Tue May 03, 2005 2:05 pm
Zipperfish Zipperfish:
$1:
China has more people in prison camps and restricted to cities where they are not allowed to travel
It's not exactly a heartening rallying cry "Hey, we're not as bad as China!"
The allegation was that the US was worse than China. We're not. Also, I've endeavoured to explain some key differences between the US and Canada.
In the microcosms of select Vancouver and Toronto neigborhoods Canada does indeed resemble parts of the USA.
Bring in a few million immigrants next year and Canada will play catch-up with us in prison building.
But Canada's current policy of keeping too many immigrants from entering works far better than building prisons.
Zipperfish @ Tue May 03, 2005 2:12 pm
Also, the prevalence of crimes involving guns is rising in Canada. The downtown eastside of Vancouver has the largest population of heroin and crack junkies in North America, I believe, and Vancouver also rates very high, even among American cities, for property crime.