Should the Burka be banned in Canada
lily lily:
I'd like to see a link to the story.
As you probably expected Lily, it is from an unconfirmed blog:
http://moderntribalist.blogspot.com/200 ... pital.html
Mind you, I do not deny there could be a cultural angle. It would be a question of giving the wrong signals.
If I invite a white woman over to my house, and she sits on my sofa and drinks my wine, then sort of puts her legs up, though her skirt is short, and shows some of her undergarments thereby, I would still read her expression and talk to see if she is really giving me a signal.
But if I was a Turk or Moroccan for instance, should I be expected to read the signals in the same way? I remember visiting a 'purdah' home in Iran, we had to stand outside and clap our hands, so that the women of the house had time to go behind the screens. They served us delicious snacks, but passed them through the curtain to menfolk. We never saw a woman.
How would such an immigrant be expected to know what signals he was getting. Seduction and invitation are genetic acts, but what exactly is a signal is cultural.
At the same time, it is sad to tell women not to mix with immigrant men. So the problem is complex and confusing.
Knoss @ Wed Dec 27, 2006 7:20 pm
$1:
Wow. Absolutely awful. We need to put controls on immigration now. Cultural suicide is unacceptable.
Canadian culture has been evolving since Canada was first occupied by nomadic hunters, thought colonial settlement and finnaly by immagrants, who came to Canada for bith political and ecconomic reasons. The idea that immagrants are going to swamp out our cultle is fundementaly flawed.
hwacker hwacker:
Trudeau changed the law in 1969 with average of 110K a year that’s 4 million dead Canadians, and the Liberals have the nerve to bitch about what’s going on with the brave troops in Afghanistan.
Knoss Knoss:
They are not babies they are foetuses. And not allowing women to choose whether or not they want to give birth is a lot more serious then burkas.
Thank you Knoss, for making a point I agree heartily with.
There is a big difference between a foetus and a baby. A woman genetically will hesitate to conceive unless she is confident that a male partner is willing to help her raise her kids. This is genetic, because kids who depend on one parent for their survival have less chance of survival. Of course, there are complications, such as women sometimes preferring one partner for home building and another for providing the genes for their child, but those are not the rule.
A woman does not wish to have a child any time she spreads her legs for a man, so the best way to differentiate a child from a foetus, biologically speaking is as follows:
A foetus is a child if and only if the following conditions are true:
a. The woman desired to conceive a child with that set of genes, and continues to desire it.
b. The woman is confident that her mate will help her to bring up the child.
Liberals help single mothers with welfare, child care and women's rights programs and thereby help more women to choose lilfe. We do not restrict choice, we help women make the correct choices.
OPP @ Wed Dec 27, 2006 7:42 pm
lily lily:
$1:
Interesting she chose to google Norway.

Actual rapes and reported rapes too officials does not always go hand in hand. Reported rapes in Sweden has been on the increase aswell and officials suspect that this increase is mostly due to awarenes campains and increased equality between the two genders.
The Rape of Europe
Source: http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/1609
The German author Henryk M. Broder recently told the Dutch newspaper De Volkskrant (12 October) that young Europeans who love freedom, better emigrate. Europe as we know it will no longer exist 20 years from now. Whilst sitting on a terrace in Berlin, Broder pointed to the other customers and the passers-by and said melancholically: “We are watching the world of yesterday.”
Europe is turning Muslim. As Broder is sixty years old he is not going to emigrate himself. “I am too old,” he said. However, he urged young people to get out and “move to Australia or New Zealand. That is the only option they have if they want to avoid the plagues that will turn the old continent uninhabitable.”
Many Germans and Dutch, apparently, did not wait for Broder’s advice. The number of emigrants leaving the Netherlands and Germany has already surpassed the number of immigrants moving in. One does not have to be prophetic to predict, like Henryk Broder, that Europe is becoming Islamic. Just consider the demographics. The number of Muslims in contemporary Europe is estimated to be 50 million. It is expected to double in twenty years. By 2025, one third of all European children will be born to Muslim families. Today Mohammed is already the most popular name for new-born boys in Brussels, Amsterdam, Rotterdam, and other major European cities.
Broder is convinced that the Europeans are not willing to oppose islamization. “The dominant ethos,” he told De Volkskrant, “is perfectly voiced by the stupid blonde woman author with whom I recently debated. She said that it is sometimes better to let yourself be raped than to risk serious injuries while resisting. She said it is sometimes better to avoid fighting than run the risk of death.”
In a recent op-ed piece in the Brussels newspaper De Standaard (23 October) the Dutch (gay and self-declared “humanist”) author Oscar Van den Boogaard refers to Broder’s interview. Van den Boogaard says that to him coping with the islamization of Europe is like “a process of mourning.” He is overwhelmed by a “feeling of sadness.” “I am not a warrior,” he says, “but who is? I have never learned to fight for my freedom. I was only good at enjoying it.”
As Tom Bethell wrote in this month’s American Spectator: “Just at the most basic level of demography the secular-humanist option is not working.” But there is more to it than the fact that non-religious people tend not to have as many children as religious people, because many of them prefer to “enjoy” freedom rather than renounce it for the sake of children. Secularists, it seems to me, are also less keen on fighting. Since they do not believe in an afterlife, this life is the only thing they have to lose. Hence they will rather accept submission than fight. Like the German feminist Broder referred to, they prefer to be raped than to resist.
“If faith collapses, civilization goes with it,” says Bethell. That is the real cause of the closing of civilization in Europe. Islamization is simply the consequence. The very word Islam means “submission” and the secularists have submitted already. Many Europeans have already become Muslims, though they do not realize it or do not want to admit it.
Some of the people I meet in the U.S. are particularly worried about the rise of anti-Semitism in Europe. They are correct when they fear that anti-Semitism is also on the rise among non-immigrant Europeans. The latter hate people with a fighting spirit. Contemporary anti-Semitism in Europe (at least when coming from native Europeans) is related to anti-Americanism. People who are not prepared to resist and are eager to submit, hate others who do not want to submit and are prepared to fight. They hate them because they are afraid that the latter will endanger their lives as well. In their view everyone must submit.
This is why they have come to hate Israel and America so much, and the small band of European “islamophobes” who dare to talk about what they see happening around them. West Europeans have to choose between submission (islam) or death. I fear, like Broder, that they have chosen submission – just like in former days when they preferred to be red rather than dead.
So true
Europe is gone already.
Xort @ Wed Dec 27, 2006 9:40 pm
If someone wants to wear sheet over their heads that's their choice. I'm not a fan in any way of Islam, or other religions but it's their option.
If they are being 'forced' then that's a matter for them to work out with their family. If they are being physicaly forced that's a matter for the police.
kaetz @ Thu Dec 28, 2006 1:27 am
tritium tritium:
kaetz kaetz:
He can, and many do so!
are you offering to shut the borders based on nationality? are you any better then Hitler? ... umm, wait! you are better! you didn't offer to burn people in concentration camps... yet
oh! what if that Syrian immigrate is a genius in math and maybe a good guy, who would finally pay taxes and have children, who would also pay taxes and thus provide for the existance of this country cause WASPs prefer to have bigger houses with no kids in them?
I'm not denying the immigration problems! I just tryng to show that blind counries' banning would be the wrong decision.
Well there we go, when the Liberals can't win an agrument they start name calling.. Hitler, WASP, Classic cool aid drinker.
"WASP" White Anglo-Saxon Protestant, yes I am, and proud of it. \\
As I stated before, both my ex-wives are minorities who are now both Canadian citizens, so your point that I am Hitler or racist is mute.
Yes, I think Canada needs to shut down the borders to certain nationalities, dam straight. Nations that promote or harbor terrorists should be banned from being allowed to immigrate here.
It's a security risk to Canada and Canadians as a whole.
first, i'm not Liberal! neither i am Con nor anthing else in these terms...
please take a trouble to read what i posted above to understand my point! i have an argument, you just didn't care to read it!
second, i believe one should be proud of something more significant then his/her skin colour!
tritium tritium:
Yes, I think Canada needs to shut down the borders to certain nationalities, dam straight.
name them straight!
yet i have a question: is it ok only with your wives to immigrate and become Canadian citizens?
kaetz @ Thu Dec 28, 2006 1:45 am
Scrappy Scrappy:
I have no issue with widowed/orphaned Muslim women and children being allowed as immigrants the MEN however yes I have an issue with them. Here's what happens to a country that opens its doors wide to a "Cult" or a "Religion" of dominance.
damn close to my point! some failed to see this, but i do not support "wide opened doors" policy. There should be a mechanism of bolting worked out! although i clearly stated it shouldn't be based only on nationality/religion!
Scrappy Scrappy:
Unni Wikan, a professor of social anthropology at the University of Oslo, in 2001 said that “Norwegian women must take their share of responsibility for these rapes” because Muslim men found their manner of dress provocative. The professor’s conclusion was not that Muslim men living in the West needed to adjust to Western norms, but the exact opposite: “Norwegian women must realize that we live in a Multicultural society and adapt themselves to it.”
whoa!!! ya know Mr. prof, go f**k yourself! multiculturalism does not imply letting all the crap into the country! I bet those rapists were not respected doctors of medicine or or professors of social anthropology!
Brenda @ Thu Dec 28, 2006 4:18 am
Hi,
I am Dutch, still living in Holland, and waiting for my PR... (so please don't mind my spelling or grammar errors
)
Holland is turning into a foolish country. For example: we have, as a tradition, Sinterklaas, each year on December 5th. (It is kind of like Christmas. We have gifts etc...) A few years ago, the Ramadan ended on that day. So what did the school my kids attend to do: they made it the end of Ramadan celebration, and no Sinterklaas. I was furious! I asked for an explanation, and the answer I got was: Well, 25 % of all students is Muslim, so that's why...
There was a great guy, called Pim Fortuyn, who stated we should close the borders, and help the people already in Holland integrate. He was shot to death. (by an animal rights activist...)
Then we had a filmmaker (Theo van Gogh) who was stabbed to death on the street in Amsterdam, because he made a movie about the Islam and what it did to women... He was stabbed to death by a Islamic guy...
I have no problem with any believe, as long as you keep it to yourself. But we are building mosques so they have their own place... I don't think I will be allowed to build a catholique church in Marrocco though...
I don't like it when someone completely covered up comes to me in the dark, during my nightshift. I think I will be robbed! It happened, and I quit my job, because I got scared.
Now we have the discussion whether the kerchief should be allowed or not in public places. Well, NOT of course. We are a Christian country, and I don't think we should allow that. People who want to live in another country, and another culture, just have to integrate. What you do at your own home is your thing, but I don't want to know what you believe. Not by looking at you.
Another thing is: language. I think it is very rude to talk your own language in public. Speak Dutch in Holland, and English in Canada. Again, what you do in your own home, is your thing, but it would be nice, when your kids are born in Holland, they speak Dutch when they go to school...
It went way too far here, and there is no turning back...
Brenda Brenda:
Hi,
I am Dutch, still living in Holland, and waiting for my PR... (so please don't mind my spelling or grammar errors

)
Holland is turning into a foolish country. For example: we have, as a tradition, Sinterklaas, each year on December 5th. (It is kind of like Christmas. We have gifts etc...) A few years ago, the Ramadan ended on that day. So what did the school my kids attend to do: they made it the end of Ramadan celebration, and no Sinterklaas. I was furious! I asked for an explanation, and the answer I got was: Well, 25 % of all students is Muslim, so that's why...
There was a great guy, called Pim Fortuyn, who stated we should close the borders, and help the people already in Holland integrate. He was shot to death. (by an animal rights activist...)
Then we had a filmmaker (Theo van Gogh) who was stabbed to death on the street in Amsterdam, because he made a movie about the Islam and what it did to women... He was stabbed to death by a Islamic guy...
I have no problem with any believe, as long as you keep it to yourself. But we are building mosques so they have their own place... I don't think I will be allowed to build a catholique church in Marrocco though...
I don't like it when someone completely covered up comes to me in the dark, during my nightshift. I think I will be robbed! It happened, and I quit my job, because I got scared.
Now we have the discussion whether the kerchief should be allowed or not in public places. Well, NOT of course. We are a Christian country, and I don't think we should allow that. People who want to live in another country, and another culture, just have to integrate. What you do at your own home is your thing, but I don't want to know what you believe. Not by looking at you.
Another thing is: language. I think it is very rude to talk your own language in public. Speak Dutch in Holland, and English in Canada. Again, what you do in your own home, is your thing, but it would be nice, when your kids are born in Holland, they speak Dutch when they go to school...
It went way too far here, and there is no turning back...
See Brenda you are living it, some here think it will be utopia but when it comes to Canada (and it’s coming) it will be another thing.
As Muslims grow in numbers they will force the country to adapt their customs, they will use the PC approach to strong arm their will on the host. These parasites will get their way unless you stand up to them, Holland is learning the hard way and Canada and the USA should use the troubles in Europe as a wakeup call.
The little liberal experiment has failed in Holland. You are living it. Thanks for your honesty.
kaetz kaetz:
yet i have a question: is it ok only with your wives to immigrate and become Canadian citizens?
That is a foolish question as the current laws allow for open immigration. You're here aren't you? It's obvious by your English you are not a first gerneration Canadian.
If the laws had been different, then I would follow them.
I hope Canada can learn from Europe's mistakes and close it's borders to Islam.
Maybe I should make a movie about Muslim women.
Knoss @ Thu Dec 28, 2006 7:39 am
$1:
A foetus is a child if and only if the following conditions are true:
a. The woman desired to conceive a child with that set of genes, and continues to desire it.
b. The woman is confident that her mate will help her to bring up the child.
just the first condition. A child in a single parrent family regardless of what parent or circumstance has the same rights as any other child.
kaetz @ Thu Dec 28, 2006 7:41 am
Brenda Brenda:
Hi,
I am Dutch, still living in Holland, and waiting for my PR... (so please don't mind my spelling or grammar errors

)
Holland is turning into a foolish country. For example: we have, as a tradition, Sinterklaas, each year on December 5th. (It is kind of like Christmas. We have gifts etc...) A few years ago, the Ramadan ended on that day. So what did the school my kids attend to do: they made it the end of Ramadan celebration, and no Sinterklaas. I was furious! I asked for an explanation, and the answer I got was: Well, 25 % of all students is Muslim, so that's why...
how about the other 75%?????
Brenda Brenda:
People who want to live in another country, and another culture, just have to integrate.
agree, if it doesn't go as far as banning Ramadan at all.
Brenda Brenda:
Another thing is: language. I think it is very rude to talk your own language in public. Speak Dutch in Holland, and English in Canada. Again, what you do in your own home, is your thing, but it would be nice, when your kids are born in Holland, they speak Dutch when they go to school...
well... i don't really mind if people sitting in a cafe talk their own language to each other... i don't listen to them anyways... otherwise it would be impolite of me
but i completely agree that one should be able to speak the language properly! This is one of the main factors of integration.
Knoss @ Thu Dec 28, 2006 7:53 am
$1:
Holland is turning into a foolish country. For example: we have, as a tradition, Sinterklaas, each year on December 5th. (It is kind of like Christmas. We have gifts etc...) A few years ago, the Ramadan ended on that day. So what did the school my kids attend to do: they made it the end of Ramadan celebration, and no Sinterklaas. I was furious! I asked for an explanation, and the answer I got was: Well, 25 % of all students is Muslim, so that's why...
Interesting, I see no reason for a large public school to celebrate Ramadan or Christmans, however Sinterklaas is to honor Saint Nicolas , the patron saint of Amsterdam. Not only that but saint worship is already discouraged by the Dutch Reformed Church, so I think it is already more of a patriotic holiday as is.
On the other hand, perhaps celebrating a minority holiday helps children understand the diverisity of the new Netherlands and the new Europe.