Native communities denounce historic treaty
saturn_656 saturn_656:
So by the time this is all said and done will BC still be a part of Canada? Considering that over 100% of it is being claimed and all.
Will a minority of people end up owning the majority of the territory?
[font=Arial]AHEM! AHH Who claimed 100% of the land in 1871? Yeah fear-mongering, just like the old reform party... [/font]
saturn_656 saturn_656:
lily lily:
First rule of negotiation - ask for the stars, settle for the moon.
The land claims NEED to be settled.
I wouldn't sign away my backyard much less any stellar real estate (I have a hard time with collective or so called "group rights"), but ok.
So if a minority section of the population ends up with rights over a vastly disproportionate sized slice of BC, you see that as a fair price to be paid so to speak?
[font=Comic Sans MS]
Sometimes I can't believe the things I read and worst, some of the politicians think this way as well. I really think some of those so-called politicians pulled their law degrees from a crackerjack box, or, bought their degrees like others who have bought their degrees. Then look what happens? Bridges collapse!In a sense the whole treaty thing is symbolic of good faith and reconcilliation. The indians were given the crappiest lands to live on with the reserves. SO why are non-natives worried? Furthermore, they don't own the reserve lands it is federal government jurisdiction. I remember in the Reform days, right wing nutters were whining about free housing and land until they realized they were the real fools with their crackerjack antics. You've got the best land etc and you have the jackass media to support you with all your BS so quit whining...it's just a sign that some of the more mature politicians are trying to do something good. Furthermore have all the fish you want on the Fraser! That whole river is just a sewer anyways[/font]
without using the policy of the US as an example......
I have read 19th century stuff to the effect that the FNs chose the crappy land because as hunting/gathering societies that provided the best hunting. Perhaps it was propaganda, which is not a new concept. The 6 nations reserve by Brantford, was sellected because the Iroquois were agricultural.
The language .(extinguish) these BC FNs use makes me suspect that a FINAL settlement is not their true intent.
ziggy @ Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:11 pm
passthedutchie passthedutchie:
lily lily:
That and they didn't "really need it".
I have mixed feelings about it, which means it's probably a fair deal.

I used to have mixed feelings, and to an extent I still do. But the funny thing is as I do more research into native issues, I find that there is a dark history, much darker than I first imagined. Canadians should be moving toward a proper reconciliation with our indigenous peoples.
Same here,some of the shit our govt. did to the native community would be unthinkable now,
I'm not into the blockades and either are the people who realize the pen is mightier than the sword,the maverick natives from yesterday are today running for council and representating their communities by being honest politicians,at least the smart ones are.We had our Mohawk like roadblocks here when the oldman river dam was planned.We had shootings and all that and it didnt solve a thing.
Back in the 50's the Innuit were issued a wooden token,like a coin,they didnt get recognized as people without it,they were used,moved and displaced in the name of sovierighnity(sp) in places like Gjoehaven and Repulse bay(worse climate in the world),traditional families were moved inland,broken up and had to learn to live off just the land and not the sea.
We as khablooniks fucked up big time,settling land claims is not much to ask for,most are reasonable.we need to settle them now or go on lining lawyers pockets with cash to fight them.
Dont get me wrong people,I'm into fair play,dishonesty isnt limited to a persons color,where ever govt. money is involved you will find corruption.this is a huge country this Canada,there is room for all of us and then some.We have the worlds largest fresh water supply,if anything,we should be thanking the native's for not fucking it up.
uwish @ Tue Oct 16, 2007 6:40 am
its time to scrap the department of indian affairs and cut up every racist, discriminatory treaty card in the country.
DangerMouse DangerMouse:
You've got the best land etc and you have the jackass media to support you with all your BS so quit whining...it's just a sign that some of the more mature politicians are trying to do something good.
Really, I have the best land??? What land did the government ever sign over to me or my "band"...
lily lily:
So you're advocating breaking treaties signed by our ancestors?
And by "our" I don't mean literally, so please don't try to sidetrack this by claiming your grandparents weren't here at the time. Neither were mine, but I still believe in honouring signed agreements.
Absolutely. I don't think treaties should have an infinite life. You have to take into account the context under which they were signed.
Did my "ancestors" have
my best interests in mind? Doubtful.
lily lily:
Very few bands got prime land, and those that did only got it by default - the land became valuable years later. Examples include the Musqueam Band with lands in South Vancouver, and the Squamish band, who owns much of West Van (Ambleside and Park Royal). Had "we" known then what "we" know now, do you really think they'd have got that land?
Uh, Indians are entitled to use to any land I am, are they not?
DangerMouse DangerMouse:
The indians were given the crappiest lands to live on with the reserves.
What land have I been given?
DangerMouse DangerMouse:
SO why are non-natives worried?
I'm not worried about anything. I just don't appreciate money transferring from my pay cheque over to some reserve.
lily lily:
My response addressed a specific point.
So did mine:
Land given to Indian bands: Lots
Land given to friends and family of Neopundit: Zero
So what right is there to complain about who got the "prime land"?
lily lily:
Their land comes with certain restrictions that your does not.
Hmm. Explain this to me.
Maybe I'm truly ignorant, but how do I have any less restrictions than others, when they are entitled to "own" land under the same principles I am? I don't get it.
lily lily:
Their land comes with certain restrictions that your does not.
We signed treaties with them, we need to honour them.
It's about time we settled the land claims.
I agree we settle the land calims. But aboriginals should not be given control over large swaths of resources in BC as long as the race-based governance structure remains in place. That is, if a Fisrt Nation wants to be treated like any other nation, they (and the federal government) have to allow for non-natives to be members of First Nations.
Knoss @ Tue Oct 16, 2007 3:44 pm
$1:
This should be no surprise. Native issues will be a growing concern for Canada in the next 5-10 years, especially as environmental concerns grow. Canadians better learn how to get along with the earth's keepers or times will be tough!
Earth's keepers?
Knoss @ Tue Oct 16, 2007 3:49 pm
$1:
I agree we settle the land calims. But aboriginals should not be given control over large swaths of resources in BC as long as the race-based governance structure remains in place. That is, if a Fisrt Nation wants to be treated like any other nation, they (and the federal government) have to allow for non-natives to be members of First Nations.
I agree fully, i also belive that first nations can be integrated as new provinces with each reserve acting as a municiaplitey or within old municipalities so long as all residents are treated equally.
lily lily:
Since we're discussing traties, it's probably understood we're talking about reserve land, which does come with restrictions.
Okay, so the reserve land has restrictions. They can, however, obtain the same land I can with less restrictions. So, by that measure, they have more than I do.
How can the restrictions on reserve land be complained about, when other people aren't even
granted reserve land?