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<strong>Written By:</strong> Eleanor
<strong>Date:</strong> 2006-07-28 09:57:54
<a href="/article/21575443-help-the-census-police-are-here">Article Link</a>

Thought I'd ask you people how you're responding. Have you been threatened with jail? Are you telling them you won't answer the questions because of Lockheed Martin? Or are you satisfied to answer the questions, now that StatsCan has had to hire extra people to do the data collection?

Is this worth becoming a "political prisoner" over? Would I be alone?

Tonight I read that some of the missiles that are tearing Lebanese civilians to shreds are Hellfires made by Lockheed Martin. The filth of the arms trade has a lot to do with this war.

So what are y'all doing about the census? We need to be together on this.










[Proofreader's note: this article was edited for spelling and typos on July 28, 2006]

   

Sadly, I am being ignored. They haven't hired enough data collectors. I intend to be very nice to them and spend a lot of time with them on the issues. Are they hourly paid?
Lebanon makes me more determined.
I've heard suggested... hand write the info on another sheet and staple it to the form, crumple it etc., but comply in a way that it must be interpreted by a real person (not a LM scanner)when you are at the point of decision on jail.
I can't seem to find that point yet.
Maybe I'll be ignored....
Maybe my sweet dog Lucy has been doing a hell of a guarding job while I am at work.

   

I have not filled out my census and continue to refuse. The nice lady that came to my door informed me that all the information is secure. (as if) I told her that I couldn't comply with war criminals and it was against my conscience. I would be happy to go to court or serve the time. My love for my country and my freedoms exceeds my personal inconvenience...

   

I am not cooperating with the census on the fundamental issue that it is mandatory subject to harsh penalties for refusal. Spending 3 months in prison is very harsh in my view considering the insignificance of not fillng out a form used to produce statistical numbers which can be accurately estimated through random sampling.

If the census was truely voluntary and a benefit to Canadian's, then just about everyone would comply without coercion. I do agree however that penalties for issuing a false return are justified since such behaviour is fraudulant. I therefore will not make false claims on the form, rather I'll refuse to cooperate, or if I decide that I cannot afford to go to jail I'll minimally cooperate with the written statement that I was under duress at the time.

Stats Can would NEVER hire the likes of LM if they did not have the means to enforce compliance. Stats Can made the decision to hire LM knowing full well that many Canadians were against such a move, so now they have to live with that mistake.

Heads should roll at Stats Can for their willful insolence, but instead they'll try and penalize innocent people who only wish to exercise their fundamental rights and not support war criminals.

Remember, we don't work for Stats Can, it works for us, and we have the right to fire those responsible for this folly.

   

Eleanor,

you are NOT alone.

reargaurd,

you have raised issues that I never considered before the LM protest that actually make me more determined to see this through. Especially the fact that, if voluntary, StatsCan would NEVER have contracted to LM. I agree 100% and that fact makes me MAD knowing they can threaten you with jail while using disreputable corporations and no guarantee that my information will not go slithering south for reasons I would not approve of. Thanks for raising that issue.

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"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music." Friedrich Nietzsche

   

"Have you been threatened with jail? "


No, but I have been called a "fucking asshole who is never home." If you are passive and non-aggressive then they will think you are a push over and will sue you. If you stand up for yourself and become a total pain in the ass then they will be more reluctant to take action against you. I would say not to answer the door, how long exactly are they going to be knocking on your door? I can't see it going past the end of September. If you do have to talk to them then tell them that you have just moved into your residence and have already filled out a census form at your old address and that you do not have to legally fill out yet another census form at your new address. The census took place back in May, you are not required under any law to fill out a census form for a place you have just moved into in July, if that was the case then they could demand you fill in a census everytime you move house. If they then ask you for your old address tell them that what they are asking you is illegal etc. They don't need to know your info as you have already provided it in a census. You are under no obligation to give them any info, even more so if you lie. How can they prove you have lied? They can't. What are they going to do? Investigate when you bought your house? If they are still in your face kick their fucking head in. This census is nothing more than a compliance exercise, if we bend over and take it up the ass then we will rue the day. I have said it before in the forum, this is the litmus test for ID cards.

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My freedom is more important than your great idea.
– Anonymous

   

Are these "nice ladies" being paid by Lockheed-Martin? Or is LM being subsidized by the federal government in this collection effort?

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"We can have a democracy or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of the few. We cannot have both."
- Justice Louis Brandeis

   

It's sickening what's happening in this country. These sellout politicians think it is their right to destroy your privacy rights.

   

You are breaking the law. What did you think would happen? You show a stunning lack of forethought.

Either your princples are worth your safety and your freedom, or they are not. Whatever you decide, you will probably grow as a person, because at the moment it seems you don't even know what to think.

Sure it's cool to follow the crowds you admire and join this boycott. (childish thinking) Fighting the system for what you think is right involves RISK and EFFORT. (adult thinking)

When things get serious, we see the men separated from the boys. Which are you?

   

<p>Eleanor,</p> <blockquote>They’ve made a number of visits to my home and fortunately I wasn’t there, but my tenants blabbed and said that I lived in a unit at the rear of the building. Afterward they told me that they had been threatened with a $500 fine or 3 months in jail if they didn’t answer the questions.</blockquote> <p>is your home (1) a “low-rise” apartment building, or (2) a single- or double-family house in which you rent rooms? If it’s (1), then wouldn’t each tenant receive his own form, since each unit would be its own “household”? If (2), does the law make you responsible for filling in the information for all of your tenants? If you are responsible, then your tenants can’t be held liable for your refusal to fill in the form, since by definition they’re not responsible for filling in your form. If you’re not responsible, then they should have received their own forms, since by definition you’re not responsible for their forms.</p> <p>Thus, in any of the cases above, any threats of punishing your tenants due solely to your actions (or inactions) would be groundless.</p> <blockquote>Is this worth becoming a “political prisoner” over?</blockquote> <p>Only you can answer that question for yourself.</p> <blockquote>Would I be alone?</blockquote> <p>If you were alone, would it change your answer to the previous question?</p> <p>If you weren’t alone, would it change your answer to if you were alone?</p><p>---<br>Shatter your ideals upon the rock of Truth.<br />
<br />
— The Divine Symphony, by Inayat Khan<br />

   

The penalty for not filling out the census form is very clear. It is a $500 fine. If you fail to pay the fine, then you go to jail for 3 months. When you go to jail they will strip search you, take a DNA sample, and get a hell of a lot more information on you than a simple census form ever would. You will then have a criminal record for the rest of your life.

Those "nice ladies" are giving you a chance to avoid the penalties. The time to worry is when the "nice ladies" stop coming to your door.

   

Who told you that they get to take a DNA sample from you if you go to jail, MGP?

Eleanor, you should read the comments in the forum.

Put your whole body into the fight. Keep on keeping on!

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"Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth."
(Albert Einstein)

   

"This census is nothing more than a compliance exercise"

I agree. There's never any need to sample 100% of every home. It is well known that a voluntary random sampling is sufficient to extract accurate statistical data which can be scaled up or down to match the number of homes that they obviously know exist.

The only reason why 100% of every home needs to be "searched" is for reasons that have nothing to do with statistics. All I can think of is the cattle farmer who wishes to take account of his flock - he won't random sample them and come up with an estimate, instead he'll count them all, much like an accountant who tracks the money down to the last penny. Imagine an accountant who estimates how much money flows through a corporation, such a thing is unheard of.

Is it mentioned by Stats Can why - by law - 100% of every last home must be searched?

What would the farmer do, if one of his flock slips through the cracks - will he forget about it, or will he go off looking for it?

LM should really have nothing to do with why you are refusing the census - it's a side issue of little importance when compared to the much more significant issue of why the census is mandatory with harsh penalties for refusal to submit to a search.

   

Just a few points of clarification. You don't get a paper form the second time, they just verbally ask you questions. (So you can't do fun things like write upside down.) My tenants all caved and answered the questions, leaving me to be the only one to refuse.

One of you asked me, WOULD IT MAKE A DIFFERENCE if I were alone in resisting? Answer: It's a matter of tactics. I want to know if there's a MOVEMENT of people, handling the situation in a consistent way, so that I can coordinate my response with theirs for greater political effectiveness.

I also wanted to know if anybody else still thinks the census SHOULD be resisted - for example, if LM is no longer involved, and we've made our point about the gov't having to hire people to do the leg work, is there still a reason to resist? Most of you agreed there is. But if any of you have knowledge of LM's continuing involvement (or lack thereof), it would be helpful to me now in making a decision about how important a cause this is.

Thanks, All.

   

By your childish response we know which one you are.

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If there was ever a time for Canadians to become pushy - now is the time - for time is running out on this nation called Canada.

   

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