Terror in T.O.

Written By: harrisp
Date: 2006-06-13 09:00:00
<a href="/article/113528284-terror-in-to">Article Link</a>

[Lost in the thousands of stories that have consumed our media during the past week is any discussion about one of the most ‘shocking’ claims: the threat that the Prime Minister and other government officials might, allegedly, be targeted for beheading. No one in the media has pursued whether that might not bring about some improvement in Canadian politics. But I digress.] There is a large number of Muslims in Canada and, for many Canadians, they are more than welcome to live here. Their culture enriches the already substantial mix of cultures that make this such an interesting country. Toronto, Canada’s largest city and the hub of all this alleged terrorist activity, is generally regarded as the most ethnically diverse city in the world. But with that mass of humanity, from so many backgrounds and cultures, it stands to reason that not all people who live here, whether born here or not, will be altogether happy with all aspects of Canadian life. It seems the young men arrested in the Centre of the Universe (all Torontonians know that you who think your home is actually the centre of the universe are simply misguided) were not happy with Canada’s position on Israel, Afghanistan, and Iraq and they were persuaded to do something about it. Something quite drastic, quite deadly, quite illegal. From what we know so far, there is the potential that these guys might have done some real damage. But the evidence made public at this point makes clear they couldn’t have done much without the assistance of our security forces. These alleged terrorists purchased a huge quantity of fertilizer (it’s ironic that you need to buy fertilizer to target Parliament Hill, where it is given away freely) in order to construct a Timothy McVeigh-type bomb. McVeigh, you will remember, parked a truck loaded with explosive ammonium nitrate fertilizer outside a federal building in Oklahoma City in 1995, resulting in the deaths of 168 people. So how did Canada’s security forces catch wind of the purchase of all this fertilizer in Toronto? Simple, they sold it to the alleged terrorists themselves. I’m no legal expert so I don’t know if this sting constitutes entrapment; but, from all the evidence released so far, it appears these terrorist dudes were absolutely toothless until the security crew sold them this ‘weapon’. Essentially, up to that point they appear to have been no more than a bunch of misguided bigmouth jerks. Does that mean they were criminals, or did our security forces help them to become criminals? Canada being what it is, there are better than even odds that some of these young men will be convicted of nothing. Not because of some legal technicality, but because they haven’t actually done anything and couldn’t have done anything without police assistance. Beyond the fact this is going to make us look inept, again, one has to question why the police initiated this action, and why at this time. To answer that, you need look no further than our Anti-Terrorism legislation. Although the federal government, the RCMP, and CSIS have been crowing about this victory over terrorism since the arrests were made, they and the obedient mainstream media, have simply been orchestrating a climate of fear, à la America’s Homeland Security. The Deputy Commissioner for the RCMP, Mike McDonnell, says that this alleged group of terrorists “posed a real threat. It had the capacity and intent to carry out these attacks.” No evidence of this has been presented, mind you, not even to the accused. But it turns out security forces had been watching this group of people since 2004 and, if police media releases and leaks are to be believed, sufficient evidence to lay charges was gathered long ago. That raises the question if ‘smashing this terrorist plot’ happened at this time for some particular reason. Of course it did. In 2001, in a knee-jerk reaction to the events of September 11, Parliament rushed through an appalling piece of work known as the Anti-Terrorism Act. That law gave police and security officials the ability to suspend civil liberties whenever it suited them, just by claiming there was some kind of plot being hatched, without the burden of actually providing any evidence. Now in the case of real plots, that kind of power might have some merit. But there are no provisions in the law that require them to persuade a judge, or a civilian or elected watchdog, that there really is a threat of some kind. We have never really liked to think of Canada as being a big-brother-is-watching kind of place, so parliamentarians took the precaution of giving this legislation an end date. Guess when it’s up for review? Yup, right now. Is it possible CSIS and the RCMP thought this was a good time to make the point that reinvigorating this draconian law would be a good thing? Is it possible that this might be a good time to seek increased security budgets? And for the federal government, who has had some difficulty convincing Canadians that we should dramatically expand our intervention in Afghanistan (one of the main gripes of the alleged terrorists), this plot could not have come at a better time. Add to that the government’s push to suck up to the Bush administration, and the reasons for the arrest of these guys at this time, and the sting that made it all possible, become self-evident. If police had sufficient evidence to arrest some or all of these guys at some point during the past two years, they should have done so. This recent action can be seen as nothing more than an orchestrated ploy for budget resources, for reinforce draconian police powers, for political gain. That’s not to say that these aren’t bad guys and that some might not belong in jail, but portraying this as a massive security threat apprehended by Dudley Do-Right and his buddies is a load of claptrap. Earlier I indicated this event should be a wake-up. But not for ordinary Canadians who can either: (a) now sleep better knowing our security folks are ever-vigilant; or (b) not sleep at all knowing our neighbours might be out to blow us up. It should be wake-up call for the Islamic community. This is a generally tolerant country but we don’t like to be frightened any more than anyone else. The Islamic community is going to have to monitor more closely its radical elements and to pay more attention to what its children are learning. Although Muslims are not alone in having extreme (perhaps even crazy) elements, their position in the world right now has created a situation where their radicals have been able to gain the hearts and minds of many otherwise decent people. It seems evident that only increased vigilance within the Muslim community is likely to be able to turn that tide. But under no circumstance should the Islamic community be blamed for these boneheads. These ones just happened to be Muslims, but whackos come in all stripes. [Proofreader's note: this article was edited for spelling and typos on June 13, 2006]

“Police swooped in and arrested 17 misguided punks”

Misguided punks? Oh boy, I don’t like where this is headed.

“But how serious might this threat have become if not for the able assistance of the RCMP and CSIS?”

What assistance? Can you clarify? Can you substantiate this claim?

“In short, the charges against them are that they have committed the crimes of being stupid and not very nice guys. I do hope the Crown has more up their judicial sleeves than that but, to date at least, that’s about what the charges amount to.”

Wrong. The charges against them are relatively clear, and have been published, however the detail behind them has, for obvious reasons, not come out yet. There are no such charges for “being stupid and not very nice guys” and it is wrong to say so.

“[Lost in the thousands of stories that have consumed our media during the past week is any discussion about one of the most ‘shocking’ claims: the threat that the Prime Minister and other government officials might, allegedly, be targeted for beheading] “

Ah, the claims made by one of the defense lawyers? Yeah. Nobody can stop talking about that. I wonder why he said it???

“From what we know so far, there is the potential that these guys might have done some real damage”

True.

“But the evidence made public at this point makes clear they couldn’t have done much without the assistance of our security forces”

But it’s pretty clear we don’t know much right now, so that’s some choice speculation.

“McVeigh, you will remember, parked a truck loaded with explosive ammonium nitrate fertilizer outside a federal building in Oklahoma City in 1995, resulting in the deaths of 168 people.”

McVeigh? Yeah, I remember that “misguided punk” too.

“So how did Canada’s security forces catch wind of the purchase of all this fertilizer in Toronto? Simple, they sold it to the alleged terrorists themselves. I’m no legal expert so I don’t know if this sting constitutes entrapment; but, from all the evidence released so far, it appears these terrorist dudes were absolutely toothless until the security crew sold them this ‘weapon’. Essentially, up to that point they appear to have been no more than a bunch of misguided bigmouth jerks. Does that mean they were criminals, or did our security forces help them to become criminals?”

Well, we don’t quite know that, do we? I mean, it has been reported widely that “misguided bigmouth jerks” received fake ammonium nitrate, as the cops switched the real stuff for the phony stuff, but do we know that the cops didn’t get notified by a distributor that sensed something fishy and stepped in? We just don’t know right now.

“Canada being what it is, there are better than even odds that some of these young men will be convicted of nothing. Not because of some legal technicality, but because they haven’t actually done anything and couldn’t have done anything without police assistance”

Some? Perhaps. All? Perhaps. None? Perhaps.

“The Deputy Commissioner for the RCMP, Mike McDonnell, says that this alleged group of terrorists “posed a real threat. It had the capacity and intent to carry out these attacks.” No evidence of this has been presented, mind you, not even to the accused.”

Patience. It’ll all come out in court.

“But it turns out security forces had been watching this group of people since 2004 and, if police media releases and leaks are to be believed, sufficient evidence to lay charges was gathered long ago. That raises the question if ‘smashing this terrorist plot’ happened at this time for some particular reason.”

Maybe they were getting close to the execution stage of their “misguided” adventure? I dunno, and of course, neither do you.

“Of course it did.”

Oh…OK. You do know.

“If police had sufficient evidence to arrest some or all of these guys at some point during the past two years, they should have done so.”

Maybe they were waiting to learn more about the involvement of others? Like the two in Atlanta or the Brit?

“…whackos come in all stripes”

Amen to that.

<blockquote>Wrong. The charges against them are relatively clear, and have been published, however the detail behind them has, for obvious reasons, not come out yet. There are no such charges for “being stupid and not very nice guys” and it is wrong to say so.</blockquote> Clear? You've got to be joking. <a href="http://www.vivelecanada.ca/comment.php?mode=view&pid=54001&sid=20060605094533654&type=article&cid=54001">See my response back to you about those charges</a>, they are laughable. The reasoning for the delay is not at all obvious. The police have told us that the "group" was being monitored for two years, and it may be that they have nothing solid against the group. The delay, may simply be intentional stalling so that new legislation or some new irreversible policy can be passed before the 17 are let off on only minor charges. There is also no such crime as being a "terrorist" or belonging to a "terrorist group" when no real crime has ever been commited - see my response in the link above for why this is so. Canada's <a href="http://www.justice.gc.ca/en/anti_terr/">Anti-Terrorism Act</a> goes against the values of justice that we traditionally have valued and fought to protect throughout the history of this country. It should be opposed by all Canadian's who wish to remain reasonably free, since anyone can be designated to be a terrorist if the Act is followed to the letter - even for speaking out against bad government policies as many of us are doing right here. If things contine as they are, today it's Al-Quada inspired terrorisim, tomorrow it'll be Vive le Canada inspired terrorism. I rather live among "terrorists" who are fighting to remain free, than among a fascist government fighting to keep us all enslaved by fear.

Re: I rather live among "terrorists" who are fighting to remain free, than among a fascist government fighting to keep us all enslaved by fear.

Yes, you've made that painfully, repugnantly clear.

Nice chatting with you.

How stupid is a group that will purchase 3 tons of ammonium nitrate at once. If anyone in this alleged group had half an ounce of intelligence the fertilizer would have been bought in small amounts by several different people. They were destined to get caught. (Not very scary.)

Does anyone remember the ricin threats in Britain in January 2003, not long before Iraq was attacked? Well, two years later a police investigation revealed that the threats had been fabricated and Britain system of justice had been “tailored to a time of terror”.

See Michel Chossudovsky’s “America’s War on Terrorism” and Mary Riddell’s article in The Observer, “With poison in their souls; The demonisation of the ricin suspects by politicians and the media smacks of Salem” (April 17, 2005)

How about Spain’s former Prime Minister Aznar addressing the Spanish parliament on an alleged terrorist chemical attack in Barcelona, about the same time Colin Powell was giving his thoroughly discredited UN speech. …… Sixteen men, suspected Al Qaeda terrorists, were arrested. Tests preformed on the substances found in their possession showed them to be harmless, including laundry detergent. The evidence was also fabricated according to the Spanish Ministry of Defense.

Sound familiar?

If no more evidence is released to the Canadian public concerning this incident, then are we looking at the same thing to extend the use of security tickets, etc as Paul mentioned? I see no reason to believe the accusations against these men when no evidence is available. This, like every other incident concerning criminal activity, should be treated like any other crime. The evidence has to be presented, supported by facts and presented publicly.

Mike
Winnipeg

"I see no reason to believe the accusations against these men when no evidence is available."

Agreed. If possession of Nitrates is a crime, then every farmer with a manure pile behind the barn is also a 'terrorist'. Everyone who is in possession of castor beans, or castor oil also has Ricin.

Guilt can only be determined on actions, not intentions. And on intentions, these guys were pretty weak.

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"I think it's important to always carry enough technology to restart civilization, should it be necessary." Mark Tilden

When is fertilizer an explosive.....? Why, it's when a screw driver is a burglar tool. Which means it can be whatever the police and the law want it to be, whenever they want it to be that.

What is happening here is a classic Hearst-ism: “You furnish the pictures and I'll furnish the war.”

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RickW

When is fertilizer an explosive? In the case of the fertilizer in question, when it's mixed with diesel fuel. Some media reports have mentioned that it needs to be mixed with another chemical. Diesel fuel is that other chemical.

Ask around any farming community, most people have their own recipes for when they want to remove stumps or large rocks. When I was a kid, my uncle's neighbour "loosened up" the dirt for an entire dug out with it. Every boy should experience the joy of seeing that much dirt fly that high in the air.

After you have your recipe mixed up, you need a way to set it off. I won't get into that because I don't have that good of a relationship with the RCMP, but it can achieved without ever going to a Radio Shack.

Which brings us to the three tons of fertilizer. I know some people who tend to buy in that kind of quantity. They all have at least one firearm too, some of them have several. I would categorize at least a couple of them as religious extremists, and at least a couple of others as political radicals. They tend to sport green headware and have skin that's dark on their forearms, but light on their shoulders. In the evenings they like to gather in a dark room and talk about politics while watching their heros on cable television and drinking the traditional drinks of their homeland.

Scared yet? You should be. Nobody knows what those rye and beer drinking farmers in their John Deere hats might get up to once the play-offs are over. ;-)

I have little doubt that at least the timing of these arrests was politically motivated. I have a strong suspicion that the arrests themselves were politically motivated.

The youngest, a 15 year old boy, is charged only with belonging to a terrorist group. The proof of that crime seems to be that he went and played paintball with the others. Does anybody know of a 15 year old boy who wouldn't like to go play paintball?

We've always had a threat of terrorism in Canada, at least in my lifetime. These are about the least competent terrorists I've ever heard of though. My guess is that if left to their own devices, they never would have purchased the fertilizer. If they did buy it, they likely would have blown their own fingers off.

I think Stephen Harper should launch an investigation into all the money that's being wasted on this.

Stephen Harper is (shall we say) looking favorably upon this. He needs the votes in T.O. next time around. And hey! if it worked for Bush..........

So we know when fertilizer is an explosive. But unless it is mixed with "anothr substance", it is STILL only fertilizer. Which means, if the cops want it to be a bomb, it will be a bomb.........

Now when is a screwdrive a burglar tool?

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RickW

When it's Doctor Who's Sonic Screwdriver?

More likely when it's in the interest of the arresting officer to claim it is.

What I keep wondering is how many really dangerous people have wandered around under the radar while our cops have been chasing a group of incompetent teenagers?

There about 124 of them in Ottawa..............

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RickW

"The purpose of economic competition is to eliminate competition"...." - John Kenneth Galbraith

Don't tell me McGuinty has found MORE "terrorists"..... 
<a href="http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2006/06/12/caledonia12062006.html">http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2006/06/12/caledonia12062006.html</a>--- RickW 
 
"The purpose of economic competition is to eliminate competition"...." - John Kenneth Galbraith

To my knowledge, no Canadian politician has ever gone to jail for commiting a crime (and they have commited many crimes). Even after being caught red-handed and confessing, as with the case of Svend Robertson, they still won't go to jail and even get to run again for office.

It's a sick and twisted judicial system, where there's laws for the rich and politically connected (who so happen to both make up the law and enforce it), and laws for the rest of us.

Those who are labeled as "Muslim extremists" who like to grow vegetables and play paint ball get the butt end of the law.

How many people did Britian's misguide punks kill in the subway bombings?
No futher responce should be necessary.

The British "punks" used HIGH explosives, 'cause they found they couldn't drive a truck into the tubes, without being noticed. Our "punks" had LOW explosives, which are much more easily tracked. LOTS of response IS necessary, especially when there is a little rot, and it's beginning to smell a bit aroound the edges of this whole thing.............

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RickW

"The purpose of economic competition is to eliminate competition"...." - John Kenneth Galbraith