The Conservative Party of Canada is A Sad Joke
kal @ Sat Dec 10, 2005 4:34 pm
$1:
By issuing a statement saying he'll have a free vote on the subject, Harper trumped a Martin ace.
I really don't think it did him any good though. Regardless of whether martin played the card, it certaintly isn't going to get him any more votes.
Blue_Nose @ Sat Dec 10, 2005 4:42 pm
MaelstromRider MaelstromRider:
By issuing a statement saying he'll have a free vote on the subject, Harper trumped a Martin ace.
Oh yeah, free votes for everything. You know what bugs me? Those damned regulations that force public places to be wheelchair accessible. I bet if we had a referendum we could convince enough people that it's too much of an inconvenience.
MaelstromRider @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 9:38 am
lily lily:
I disagree. A free vote on whether to grant (or rather, deny) rights to a segment of the population isn't a good idea.
Reopening the debate further cements the view many have of Harper - that of an intolerant man intent on running the country based on his own morals.
Reopening the debate further cements the view many have of Harper - that of an intolerant man intent on running the country based on his own morals.
I don't think we disagree at all. I wish he had left the issue alone too. Frankly I'm sick of wasting time debating it.
kal kal:
I really don't think it did him any good though. Regardless of whether martin played the card, it certaintly isn't going to get him any more votes.
Its all about how Harper sells happroach to tackling the issue, not the issue itself. If he can spin it so that he appears to be taking a more democtratic approach to the issue than Martin did, he may win some votes. Besides SSM is the most divisive (non)issue in the country. It's pretty much a 50:50 split.
Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:
Oh yeah, free votes for everything. You know what bugs me? Those damned regulations that force public places to be wheelchair accessible. I bet if we had a referendum we could convince enough people that it's too much of an inconvenience.
Agreed. Damn ramps.
Seriously, I doubt Harper will be as democrcay loving when the issue isn't something he thinks he can win. The way I see this, it's a campaign tactic to defeat a potentially daming attack by the Martin camp. Good strategy...
I agree with everyone that Canadians would be better off if issue would have been left dead, but I do think that Harper made a sound decision bringing this into his campaign early. He took the initiative from Martin and prevented anyone from claiming his party has some kind of hidden agenda on SSM.
Good for Canada? Not in my opinion.
Good politics? We'll see when we hit the polls...
Streaker @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 4:14 pm
$1:
Tories complaining in Quebec
By GLORIA GALLOWAY
Thursday, December 8, 2005 Page A11
OTTAWA -- Some Conservative candidates in Quebec say they are being denied adequate resources to mount successful campaigns and charge that the party is concentrating its efforts in regions where it has a better chance of making gains.
As of yesterday afternoon, the Conservative Party website listed no nominated candidates in 20 of the 75 ridings in the province. In Ontario, by contrast, there were candidates named for all but two of the 106 ridings.
The disgruntled candidates, who refuse to be identified out of fear of retribution from Conservative officials, say they have each been given $2,000 by the party. During the 2004 campaign, they say, they were given an average of $5,000 and some received much more.
Many Tory candidates in other parts of the country receive no money from the party. But they are better able to raise their own funds locally than Tories in Quebec where support for the party is hovering at about 4 per cent.
Michael Fortier, co-chair of the party's national campaign, said in an interview from London yesterday that the Quebec candidates are being given the same amount of money they received in 2004.
"I can tell you we did not have five grand per riding, that's for sure," he said, adding that there will be additional help for those candidates who have problems fundraising.
There is a conspiracy theory being widely circulated among Quebec party members that alleges the Conservatives are deliberately ignoring the province because they don't want to bleed nationalist support away from the Bloc Québécois. The more seats won by the Bloc, the theory suggests, the fewer seats won by Liberals -- which would improve Conservative chances of forming the next federal government.
But Mr. Fortier said he wouldn't have accepted the job of campaign co-chair if the strategy was to ignore Quebec.
And, he said, the party will spend close to $1-million on French-language ads, which began airing yesterday.
"We want to win seats," he said. "We think we can win seats."
Frédérick Têtu, a philosophy professor who quit last June as the Conservative candidate in the Quebec riding of Louis-Hébert, said he has heard the conspiracy theory but does not believe it.
"I trust that [Conservative Leader Stephen] Harper does care about Quebec," he said. In fact, Quebec City was Mr. Harper's first campaign stop after leaving Ottawa last week.
There has been a lot of party money directed at the province in the past year, Mr. Tétu said. Much of it has gone to hire six organizers as well as pay the salary of Josée Verner, one of Mr. Harper's Quebec lieutenants.
"But the people who were trusted with spending the money were not up to the task," he said.
Mr. Têtu, who not only resigned as a candidate but quit the party over the lack of organization, said that Mr. Harper is a serious man who would make a good prime minister, but that he does not understand Quebec.
People from the Reform-Alliance branch of the party think that, if rules are made, they will be followed, he said.
But there is still a large faction of Quebec Conservatives who believe politics is more about establishing and exploiting personal relationships, he said.
"Many Quebeckers have not reconciled themselves with the leadership of Stephen Harper," he said.
He has noticed an evaporation of candidates since last spring. Some have quit. Others have been dropped.
Ann Julie Fortier, who had been nominated in Berthier-Maskinongé, was actively campaigning until yesterday when she was told she was no longer a candidate.
"They replaced me," she said tearfully. "I called this morning for some help during the campaign and they said no, you aren't running there any more."
Some of her friends have suggested she was dumped because she complained publicly about the lack of organization within the Quebec wing of party in a Globe and Mail article in September. Ms. Fortier said she was told she was being replaced by someone with more ties to the community she hoped to represent.
Link
By GLORIA GALLOWAY
Thursday, December 8, 2005 Page A11
OTTAWA -- Some Conservative candidates in Quebec say they are being denied adequate resources to mount successful campaigns and charge that the party is concentrating its efforts in regions where it has a better chance of making gains.
As of yesterday afternoon, the Conservative Party website listed no nominated candidates in 20 of the 75 ridings in the province. In Ontario, by contrast, there were candidates named for all but two of the 106 ridings.
The disgruntled candidates, who refuse to be identified out of fear of retribution from Conservative officials, say they have each been given $2,000 by the party. During the 2004 campaign, they say, they were given an average of $5,000 and some received much more.
Many Tory candidates in other parts of the country receive no money from the party. But they are better able to raise their own funds locally than Tories in Quebec where support for the party is hovering at about 4 per cent.
Michael Fortier, co-chair of the party's national campaign, said in an interview from London yesterday that the Quebec candidates are being given the same amount of money they received in 2004.
"I can tell you we did not have five grand per riding, that's for sure," he said, adding that there will be additional help for those candidates who have problems fundraising.
There is a conspiracy theory being widely circulated among Quebec party members that alleges the Conservatives are deliberately ignoring the province because they don't want to bleed nationalist support away from the Bloc Québécois. The more seats won by the Bloc, the theory suggests, the fewer seats won by Liberals -- which would improve Conservative chances of forming the next federal government.
But Mr. Fortier said he wouldn't have accepted the job of campaign co-chair if the strategy was to ignore Quebec.
And, he said, the party will spend close to $1-million on French-language ads, which began airing yesterday.
"We want to win seats," he said. "We think we can win seats."
Frédérick Têtu, a philosophy professor who quit last June as the Conservative candidate in the Quebec riding of Louis-Hébert, said he has heard the conspiracy theory but does not believe it.
"I trust that [Conservative Leader Stephen] Harper does care about Quebec," he said. In fact, Quebec City was Mr. Harper's first campaign stop after leaving Ottawa last week.
There has been a lot of party money directed at the province in the past year, Mr. Tétu said. Much of it has gone to hire six organizers as well as pay the salary of Josée Verner, one of Mr. Harper's Quebec lieutenants.
"But the people who were trusted with spending the money were not up to the task," he said.
Mr. Têtu, who not only resigned as a candidate but quit the party over the lack of organization, said that Mr. Harper is a serious man who would make a good prime minister, but that he does not understand Quebec.
People from the Reform-Alliance branch of the party think that, if rules are made, they will be followed, he said.
But there is still a large faction of Quebec Conservatives who believe politics is more about establishing and exploiting personal relationships, he said.
"Many Quebeckers have not reconciled themselves with the leadership of Stephen Harper," he said.
He has noticed an evaporation of candidates since last spring. Some have quit. Others have been dropped.
Ann Julie Fortier, who had been nominated in Berthier-Maskinongé, was actively campaigning until yesterday when she was told she was no longer a candidate.
"They replaced me," she said tearfully. "I called this morning for some help during the campaign and they said no, you aren't running there any more."
Some of her friends have suggested she was dumped because she complained publicly about the lack of organization within the Quebec wing of party in a Globe and Mail article in September. Ms. Fortier said she was told she was being replaced by someone with more ties to the community she hoped to represent.
So at the start of the campaign Harper decides to alienate many voters by resurrecting the SSM issue, and now there are indications that the Cons are throwing in the towel in Quebec in order to provide a boost to the Bloc. Not only that but they haven't even got a full slate of candidates in Quebec.
Funny, isn't it? Parties like the Greens and the NDP are ardently campaigning in Quebec even though they won't win any seats there. The Conservatives, on the other hand, are writing off Quebec and that will not only obviously cost them votes in Quebec, but will also do so in Ontario.
Harper couldn't even be bothered to learn the names of his Quebec City-area candidates. 'Tis truly sad.
Other than the BQ, is there anything nastier in Canadian politics than the CPC? Why on Earth is the CPC behaving like a regional protest party if it aspires to power?
The Hoser @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 4:19 pm
Not only is the party a sad joke, its leader is a zombie.
I swear he's opperated by strings in his latest ad campaign... and his eyes are so grey and lifeless.
Dayseed @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:05 pm
Hoser,
Are you talking about those ads that look like bad Breakfast Television segments where Harper fields a ridiculously easy question from a "person in the street"?
Apparently the "Write A Television Commercial For The Conservatives And See It Live On TV!" should have carried a disclaimer saying that children OVER 11 were also allowed to enter.
Jaime_Souviens @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:13 pm
Streaker Streaker:
So at the start of the campaign Harper decides to alienate many voters by resurrecting the SSM issue, and now there are indications that the Cons are throwing in the towel in Quebec in order to provide a boost to the Bloc. Not only that but they haven't even got a full slate of candidates in Quebec.
Funny, isn't it? Parties like the Greens and the NDP are ardently campaigning in Quebec even though they won't win any seats there. The Conservatives, on the other hand, are writing off Quebec and that will not only obviously cost them votes in Quebec, but will also do so in Ontario.
Harper couldn't even be bothered to learn the names of his Quebec City-area candidates. 'Tis truly sad.
Other than the BQ, is there anything nastier in Canadian politics than the CPC? Why on Earth is the CPC behaving like a regional protest party if it aspires to power?
Funny, isn't it? Parties like the Greens and the NDP are ardently campaigning in Quebec even though they won't win any seats there. The Conservatives, on the other hand, are writing off Quebec and that will not only obviously cost them votes in Quebec, but will also do so in Ontario.
Harper couldn't even be bothered to learn the names of his Quebec City-area candidates. 'Tis truly sad.
Other than the BQ, is there anything nastier in Canadian politics than the CPC? Why on Earth is the CPC behaving like a regional protest party if it aspires to power?
Could there be an agreement to form a government together?
RUEZ @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:15 pm
The Hoser The Hoser:
Not only is the party a sad joke, its leader is a zombie.
I swear he's opperated by strings in his latest ad campaign... and his eyes are so grey and lifeless.
Yes because that's how we judge a good leader, rather than how much they steal from us. I swear he's opperated by strings in his latest ad campaign... and his eyes are so grey and lifeless.
Streaker @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:22 pm
Jaime_Souviens Jaime_Souviens:
Streaker Streaker:
So at the start of the campaign Harper decides to alienate many voters by resurrecting the SSM issue, and now there are indications that the Cons are throwing in the towel in Quebec in order to provide a boost to the Bloc. Not only that but they haven't even got a full slate of candidates in Quebec.
Funny, isn't it? Parties like the Greens and the NDP are ardently campaigning in Quebec even though they won't win any seats there. The Conservatives, on the other hand, are writing off Quebec and that will not only obviously cost them votes in Quebec, but will also do so in Ontario.
Harper couldn't even be bothered to learn the names of his Quebec City-area candidates. 'Tis truly sad.
Other than the BQ, is there anything nastier in Canadian politics than the CPC? Why on Earth is the CPC behaving like a regional protest party if it aspires to power?
Funny, isn't it? Parties like the Greens and the NDP are ardently campaigning in Quebec even though they won't win any seats there. The Conservatives, on the other hand, are writing off Quebec and that will not only obviously cost them votes in Quebec, but will also do so in Ontario.
Harper couldn't even be bothered to learn the names of his Quebec City-area candidates. 'Tis truly sad.
Other than the BQ, is there anything nastier in Canadian politics than the CPC? Why on Earth is the CPC behaving like a regional protest party if it aspires to power?
Could there be an agreement to form a government together?
This is a fascinating scenario, the Bloc and the Cons make natural allies in terms of defending provincial and regional rights vs. Ottawa, but otherwise they have next to nothing in common.
I could see them cooperating on some very specific matters but forming a coalition government? Not likely.
The Hoser @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:22 pm
Dayseed Dayseed:
Hoser,
Are you talking about those ads that look like bad Breakfast Television segments where Harper fields a ridiculously easy question from a "person in the street"?
Apparently the "Write A Television Commercial For The Conservatives And See It Live On TV!" should have carried a disclaimer saying that children OVER 11 were also allowed to enter.
Are you talking about those ads that look like bad Breakfast Television segments where Harper fields a ridiculously easy question from a "person in the street"?
Apparently the "Write A Television Commercial For The Conservatives And See It Live On TV!" should have carried a disclaimer saying that children OVER 11 were also allowed to enter.
Yes, those are the ones to which I refer. The one where you expect Harper to grunt 'Braiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiins' and than rip open the ladies skull.
Jaime_Souviens @ Sun Dec 11, 2005 6:33 pm
Streaker Streaker:
Jaime_Souviens Jaime_Souviens:
Streaker Streaker:
So at the start of the campaign Harper decides to alienate many voters by resurrecting the SSM issue, and now there are indications that the Cons are throwing in the towel in Quebec in order to provide a boost to the Bloc. Not only that but they haven't even got a full slate of candidates in Quebec.
Funny, isn't it? Parties like the Greens and the NDP are ardently campaigning in Quebec even though they won't win any seats there. The Conservatives, on the other hand, are writing off Quebec and that will not only obviously cost them votes in Quebec, but will also do so in Ontario.
Harper couldn't even be bothered to learn the names of his Quebec City-area candidates. 'Tis truly sad.
Other than the BQ, is there anything nastier in Canadian politics than the CPC? Why on Earth is the CPC behaving like a regional protest party if it aspires to power?
Funny, isn't it? Parties like the Greens and the NDP are ardently campaigning in Quebec even though they won't win any seats there. The Conservatives, on the other hand, are writing off Quebec and that will not only obviously cost them votes in Quebec, but will also do so in Ontario.
Harper couldn't even be bothered to learn the names of his Quebec City-area candidates. 'Tis truly sad.
Other than the BQ, is there anything nastier in Canadian politics than the CPC? Why on Earth is the CPC behaving like a regional protest party if it aspires to power?
Could there be an agreement to form a government together?
This is a fascinating scenario, the Bloc and the Cons make natural allies in terms of defending provincial and regional rights vs. Ottawa, but otherwise they have next to nothing in common.
I could see them cooperating on some very specific matters but forming a coalition government? Not likely.
Well, a coalition government can be based on shared principles, but you could also do it based on a splitting of responsibilities. The CPC takes the foreign, economic ministries, and give the social services ones to Bloc cabinet members.
The Isrealis do crap like this all the time.
And if you're out to restructure the federal system, you'd almost have to have the Bloc participate.
Streaker @ Mon Dec 12, 2005 11:52 pm
The Hoser The Hoser:
Dayseed Dayseed:
Hoser,
Are you talking about those ads that look like bad Breakfast Television segments where Harper fields a ridiculously easy question from a "person in the street"?
Apparently the "Write A Television Commercial For The Conservatives And See It Live On TV!" should have carried a disclaimer saying that children OVER 11 were also allowed to enter.
Are you talking about those ads that look like bad Breakfast Television segments where Harper fields a ridiculously easy question from a "person in the street"?
Apparently the "Write A Television Commercial For The Conservatives And See It Live On TV!" should have carried a disclaimer saying that children OVER 11 were also allowed to enter.
Yes, those are the ones to which I refer. The one where you expect Harper to grunt 'Braiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiins' and than rip open the ladies skull.
When Harper is giving his answers you have to keep your eye on the woman "interviewing" him. The expression on her face is priceless!
