Ontario announces Windsor-Toronto High-Speed Rail line
BeaverFever @ Fri May 19, 2017 10:31 am
$1:
Ontario plans high-speed train between Toronto and Windsor
2 hours ago
REUTERS
Ontario Premier Kathleen Wynne speaks in Toronto on Dec. 12, 2016.
MARK BLINCH/REUTERS
A high-speed rail corridor between Toronto and Windsor, Ont., is in the works — an idea floated in Ontario for decades, but the premier says this time it's happening.
A government-commissioned report looking at the feasibility of such a project pegs the cost around $20 billion and suggests looking to the private sector for opportunities to partner on funding.
Preliminary design work and a $15-million environmental assessment are beginning, with an aim of full service in 2031.
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Read more: Canada Infrastructure Bank could fund high-speed rail in Alberta, Ontario
Trains on the planned rail link would travel up to 250 kilometres per hour, which is expected to cut travel times between Toronto and Windsor from four hours to two.
Premier Kathleen Wynne said not only will it save people time, but it will serve as an economic driver along a corridor that is home to more than seven million people and over 60 per cent of Ontario's economic activity.
High-speed rail has been debated since the 1970s, with excuses that the country is too large, the population is too small, and it's not worth it, but it needs to happen now, Wynne said.
"We have lost opportunities as a province because we haven't had this line in place," she said Friday in London, Ont., a mid-point for the rail route.
"I get that there's going to be a robust conversation about how much it will cost — how much the project will cost, how much people will pay — we obviously are going to work to keep the costs down in every way possible, but we've got to move ahead. We've got to not let this be another lost moment. We've got to do it this time, folks."
The government says Ontario is the first province to undertake a "rail transformation" on this scale. A new public entity will be established to oversee the project.
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In 2015, the government tapped a special adviser on high-speed rail to assess the possibility of such a project, and David Collenette concluded there is a business case for it.
It would alleviate pressure on the heavily-travelled Highway 401, free up air travel capacity by lessening the need for short-haul flights and spur regional development, he wrote.
Collenette, a former federal transportation minister, recommended the first phase connect Toronto and London by 2025, then extend the line to Windsor in a second phase.
He looked at the possibility of a line operating mostly on a dedicated right-of-way with top speeds to 300 kilometres per hour, but found it would have been more expensive than a line operating on a mixed-use railway.
2 hours ago
REUTERS
Ontario Premier Kathleen Wynne speaks in Toronto on Dec. 12, 2016.
MARK BLINCH/REUTERS
A high-speed rail corridor between Toronto and Windsor, Ont., is in the works — an idea floated in Ontario for decades, but the premier says this time it's happening.
A government-commissioned report looking at the feasibility of such a project pegs the cost around $20 billion and suggests looking to the private sector for opportunities to partner on funding.
Preliminary design work and a $15-million environmental assessment are beginning, with an aim of full service in 2031.
Story continues below advertisement
Read more: Canada Infrastructure Bank could fund high-speed rail in Alberta, Ontario
Trains on the planned rail link would travel up to 250 kilometres per hour, which is expected to cut travel times between Toronto and Windsor from four hours to two.
Premier Kathleen Wynne said not only will it save people time, but it will serve as an economic driver along a corridor that is home to more than seven million people and over 60 per cent of Ontario's economic activity.
High-speed rail has been debated since the 1970s, with excuses that the country is too large, the population is too small, and it's not worth it, but it needs to happen now, Wynne said.
"We have lost opportunities as a province because we haven't had this line in place," she said Friday in London, Ont., a mid-point for the rail route.
"I get that there's going to be a robust conversation about how much it will cost — how much the project will cost, how much people will pay — we obviously are going to work to keep the costs down in every way possible, but we've got to move ahead. We've got to not let this be another lost moment. We've got to do it this time, folks."
The government says Ontario is the first province to undertake a "rail transformation" on this scale. A new public entity will be established to oversee the project.
Story continues below advertisement
In 2015, the government tapped a special adviser on high-speed rail to assess the possibility of such a project, and David Collenette concluded there is a business case for it.
It would alleviate pressure on the heavily-travelled Highway 401, free up air travel capacity by lessening the need for short-haul flights and spur regional development, he wrote.
Collenette, a former federal transportation minister, recommended the first phase connect Toronto and London by 2025, then extend the line to Windsor in a second phase.
He looked at the possibility of a line operating mostly on a dedicated right-of-way with top speeds to 300 kilometres per hour, but found it would have been more expensive than a line operating on a mixed-use railway.
https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/news/n ... ice=mobile
My thoughts:
1). I'll believe it when I see it. As the article mentions, HSR has been talked about for decades and studied to death by province and feds but never happens. "Dream small" and "acheive modestly" are the unofficial Canadian mottos. There are a lot of elections and budgets between now and 2031 that this project will have to survive. .
2). Case in point, the last paragraph. Already the recommendation is dialed down to a slower train on a mixed-use track....mixed use bringing with it all kinds of delays and scheduling/signaling issues. It's like there's this societal bias against selecting the best product, lest someone think you're imprudent; always have to select the second or third best or "middle of the road " option regardless of what that entails or else you're being irresponsible.
martin14 @ Fri May 19, 2017 11:03 am
Complete waste of money, but I'm sure the Liberals and friends will be able to steal a couple of billion from it, and then the Liberal gov't can put more taxes on, to help pay for all the cost overruns, breakdowns, corruption, and the fact that the trains will
never run at a profit.
BeaverFever @ Fri May 19, 2017 11:06 am
martin14 martin14:
Complete waste of money, but I'm sure the Liberals and friends will be able to steal a couple of billion from it, and then the Liberal gov't can put more taxes on, to help pay for all the cost overruns, breakdowns, corruption, and the fact that the trains will
never run at a profit.
never run at a profit.
herbie @ Fri May 19, 2017 11:25 am
Eggh! Trains are supposed to trundle along. The human body can't take speeds over 30 mph! Get off my lawn!
martin14 @ Fri May 19, 2017 11:32 am
Mark this page I will proven correct. 
And BF will be daily proven as a Liberal hack.
Tricks @ Fri May 19, 2017 11:39 am
$1:
Premier Kathleen Wynne said not only will it save people time, but it will serve as an economic driver along a corridor that is home to more than seven million people and over 60 per cent of Ontario's economic activity.
That doesn't make any sense to me. Aren't high speed rails normally very few, if any, stops? Toronto and windsor would be the only stops no? Or else the time to slow down and start every 10-15 km would mean it's not going to be all that high speed. If I'm wrong, please correct me. But if I'm not wrong, then that statement is basically pure bullshit.
BeaverFever @ Fri May 19, 2017 11:52 am
martin14 martin14:
Mark this page I will proven correct.
And BF will be daily proven as a Liberal hack.
And BF will be daily proven as a Liberal hack.
You've never been correct about anything in your life. And this "Liberal hack" has already posted his criticisms if you weren't so learning disabled you might have noticed.
BeaverFever @ Fri May 19, 2017 12:01 pm
Tricks Tricks:
$1:
Premier Kathleen Wynne said not only will it save people time, but it will serve as an economic driver along a corridor that is home to more than seven million people and over 60 per cent of Ontario's economic activity.
That doesn't make any sense to me. Aren't high speed rails normally very few, if any, stops? Toronto and windsor would be the only stops no? Or else the time to slow down and start every 10-15 km would mean it's not going to be all that high speed. If I'm wrong, please correct me. But if I'm not wrong, then that statement is basically pure bullshit.From a different article:
[quote]The train would travel between Toronto's Union Station and Pearson International Airport, Guelph, Kitchener, London, Chatham and Windsor.[quote]
I bet the train (if ever built) doesn't go to Union and instead just connects to the UP Express It wouldn't make sense to have 2 trains running between union and pearson.
Additional musings:
I wonder how many people would actually travel this line on a daily basis?
That territory is where they put all the wind farms and now full of anti-windmill people who hate the government. Will they be happier or angrier when they can't hear the windmills in the back yard over the high-speed trains in the front yard?
Tricks @ Fri May 19, 2017 12:07 pm
BeaverFever BeaverFever:
Tricks Tricks:
$1:
Premier Kathleen Wynne said not only will it save people time, but it will serve as an economic driver along a corridor that is home to more than seven million people and over 60 per cent of Ontario's economic activity.
That doesn't make any sense to me. Aren't high speed rails normally very few, if any, stops? Toronto and windsor would be the only stops no? Or else the time to slow down and start every 10-15 km would mean it's not going to be all that high speed. If I'm wrong, please correct me. But if I'm not wrong, then that statement is basically pure bullshit.From a different article:
$1:
The train would travel between Toronto's Union Station and Pearson International Airport, Guelph, Kitchener, London, Chatham and Windsor.
I bet the train (if ever built) doesn't go to Union and instead just connects to the UP Express It wouldn't make sense to have 2 trains running between union and pearson.
Additional musings:
I wonder how many people would actually travel this line on a daily basis?
That territory is where they put all the wind farms and now full of anti-windmill people who hate the government. Will they be happier or angrier when they can't hear the windmills in the back yard over the high-speed trains in the front yard?
$1:
I bet the train (if ever built) doesn't go to Union and instead just connects to the UP Express It wouldn't make sense to have 2 trains running between union and pearson.
Additional musings:
I wonder how many people would actually travel this line on a daily basis?
That territory is where they put all the wind farms and now full of anti-windmill people who hate the government. Will they be happier or angrier when they can't hear the windmills in the back yard over the high-speed trains in the front yard?
Ah those stops make more sense then. Thanks for the info!
herbie @ Fri May 19, 2017 12:20 pm
$1:
the fact that the trains will
never run at a profit.
never run at a profit.
Profit is an objective of public transit?
BartSimpson @ Fri May 19, 2017 12:25 pm
martin14 martin14:
Complete waste of money, but I'm sure the Liberals and friends will be able to steal a couple of billion from it, and then the Liberal gov't can put more taxes on, to help pay for all the cost overruns, breakdowns, corruption, and the fact that the trains will
never run at a profit.
never run at a profit.
You've just described every other rail project in North America. No reason why this one should be any different.
BartSimpson @ Fri May 19, 2017 12:28 pm
herbie herbie:
$1:
the fact that the trains will
never run at a profit.
never run at a profit.
Profit is an objective of public transit?
If you're a liberal, yes it is.
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/201 ... ments.html
US Senator Dianne Feinstein's husband wins near-billion dollar California 'high speed rail' contract
housewife @ Fri May 19, 2017 12:31 pm
Nice idea but perhaps they could fix the tracks in all of Ontario first. Instead of just dropping the speed. There might still be time for repairs instead replacing.
PluggyRug @ Fri May 19, 2017 12:32 pm
We should follow England and go the whole hog.
http://www.express.co.uk/travel/article ... ort-bosses
BeaverFever @ Fri May 19, 2017 1:07 pm
But if you think about it....the population is not evenly distributed: of those seven million people, six are at one end of the line, in the GTA. The other one million are sprinkled in these relatively small clusters...London and Windsor alone account for 2/3rds of that. Chatham is small but a halfway point on the long stretch between the two. It doesn't make sense to me that they stop in both Kithener and Guelph considering how close they are to each other.....Kitchener makes more sense as together with Waterloo its twice the size and closer to Cambrdge.