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Full title:

Mexico security officials likely conspired in massacre of 43 students: state government

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/mexico-secu ... z3FOHspo4q

Here's a question...in this case the police have been infiltrated by a criminal gang and they're actively murdering law abiding citizens. So does anyone argue that these citizens do not have a right to arm themselves and defend themselves from these rogue police? Or do they have an obligation to die?

   

Bart quit confusing the far left. You know they can not ever see a reason why someone should have a gun.

   

Chit, the Cartels always infiltrate Police, Military ie the Army in MX. Been numerous try's across TX Border. The Cartels use proxies in the US ie the MX Mafia, MS13 and have killed local US Police officer's, I could think of a few case's in the San Antonio Area. Here in NV we have been battling MS13 and Cartels and grow operations in BFE NV. Those Jackass escapee's from Southern Cali don't help either.

   

It's Mexico.....wouldn't assume any different.

   

I'll take you up on this discussion but I'd like to gauge the level of your commitment to armed citizens first just so I know where you stand please answer yes or no to the following questions.

- Should any citizen be allowed to own a firearm without training?
- Should a non citizen or illegal alien be allowed to purchase or possess a firearm under the same laws that you favour for a citizen?
- Should anyone be allowed to purchase a firearm without waiting or background checks?
- Should a private law abiding citizen be allowed to own military type firearms and ammunition?
- Should law abiding adults have the right to carry concealed weapons in public places?
- Should law abiding youth who are trained and mature enough be allowed to carry concealed weapons in public places?
- Should open carry in public of any type of firearm by anyone be allowed?
- Is there any public place that weapons should not be allowed under any circumstances?
- Should there be any purchase restrictions for a law abiding citizen with a history of mental issues?

For full disclosure I answer no to everything on the list except yes to the last two.

   

Yes. Just the same as you can own a car without learning to drive. What you do with it is up to you.




In their home country, yes, in someone else's country I'll leave that to the local legislature to decide.



We live in a time of instant access to information. If the background check is instantaneous then yes. I oppose waiting periods as they have not ever been shown to enhance public safety.



Yes.



Yes.



If they're old enough to carry a weapon in service to their country, then yes.



Yes. Note that I distinguish between 'open carry' and brandishing.



Courtrooms.



Depends on the mental issue.



Fair enough.

   

For clarification Bart: Airports, political rallies, schools, Disneyland etc are all public places and are acceptable places to bring firearms in your opinion?

   

Don't ever carry a firearm inside a US Airport unless you are authorized and security clears you. As for guns in PS Schools check TX, they have it right. Political Rallies is a Freedom of Speech and assembly be it armed or unarmed. Local LE's determine if there is a threat to warrant check ya rod. Disney like Six Flags is Private company and thus they have there own rules which local LE's can enforce. Public Parks depends on State and Local Law.

   

Most airports these days are armed to the teeth and in many parts of the world the parts of the airport outside of the secure areas are open to legal carry.

I'm fine with restricting firearms at leftist political rallies if that makes you feel any better. Frankly, I think that anyone who advocates against gun rights should be among the first to have them restricted.

No one at the old Sandy Hook school was armed the day the nutbag showed up. At the new Sandy Hook school there are two armed guards on campus and two more patrolling the immediate area. Seems to me even the gun-grabbers in Connecticut have managed to figure out that the only thing that can stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. In this case they have four of them.

What Disneyland, Disneyworld, Aulani Resort, Castaway Cay, and Disney Cruise ships all have in common is that none of them are public places. Conflating them with public places is bad form on your part.

   

I only have a few moments and my form is fine Bart. To clarify American law for you Disneyland like any shopping mall, church, store or even a private club or school are still legally regarded as a public place:

A public place is generally an indoor or outdoor area, whether privately or publicly owned, to which the public have access by right or by invitation, expressed or implied, whether by payment of money or not, but not a place when used exclusively by one or more individuals for a private gathering or other personal purpose

http://definitions.uslegal.com/p/public-place/

Hopefully this clears up your confusion about what constitutes public and private property.

   

This case:

http://www.ca10.uscourts.gov/opinions/07/07-5166.pdf

Established that parking lots are public areas. It also left a lot of leeway for limits on carry inside of a facility.

As to Disney...

http://www.dsasd.org/detail/dsasd/where ... y_your_gun



So for the purposes of this topic Disney is not a public space the same as any other public space at least when it comes to this topic.

For the record, I support the right of a business to prohibit concealed carry or open carry as they see fit. It's their business.

   

How about we cut to the chase and get back on topic here. Bart is insinuating that if this happens in Mexico then it must be happening in the US. Which bolsters his right to carry any weapon he chooses to protect himself against them. Mexico has been a corrupt shit hole right from day one, so why should any of us care?

EDIT
After all........how many stories like this come from Mexico?
https://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/good-ne ... 27827.html

There's another CKA thread on this too.

   

Odd opinion to have, because usually in the US these days big piles of murdered bodies only appear when some self-appointed well-regulated militiaman vents his spleen on people he simply doesn't like.

   

Interestingly enough, yes it is. Not to the degree as we see in Mexico yet all the same we are seeing police agencies being infiltrated by the drug cartels.

Which makes sense given the legions of cops who use illegal steroids.

   

As well as the US military.

   

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