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Or just don't know themselves. Maybe they're too busy working 3 min wage part time jobs. It's the same reason we want schools to take on all sorts of parental functions, because we have people who are struggling themselves raising kids. Why do schools have to go begging for charity for breakfast programs for kids - because the parents aren't able to do it themselves.

Sure, nice, middle class parents can do this better than any school can, or lets say differently and they can complement each other. Unfortunately we're busy kicking the shit out of nice, middle class families right now, so there'll be less and less of this in the future. As the OP makes clear.

   

And your solution to the problem would be:

1. Improving the economy so middle class families live better and so lower class families have more opportunities to move into the middle class?

2. Make well-off people poorer so the poor and middle class can at least get some satisfaction that everyone else is miserable, too?

   

Well, I'm a high school drop-out, so maybe the wrong one to ask.

My old grilfreind was told by her school counsellor that she reallly didn't want to do enigneering and maybe something like nursing would be better for her. My wife's career counsellor, when asked about engineering just said that she didn't really understand what engineers did.

So anecdotal info, but there you have it. My life experience is that a lot of kids--most kids--don't have a good handle on what they want to do after hogh school. Maybe a year working isn't such a bad idea, and maybe some time on the road too.

   

Absolutely. While I was doing my undergrad, had a friend who was finishing his PhD (maybe a couple years older than me) He'd been in school steady since age 6, felt life had passed him by. That's one good thing about our system vs say Germany. We can be goof offs when we're young, (I dropped out of highschool too) and still find our way later, it's not all slotted in for us, miss the slot and you're done.

Don't know about this on the road business tho. I thought only abused runaways did that now. Travel is great, but to me on the road means hitchhiking around. Kind of a different scene than when I was young.

   

The problem I see with the whole "take a year off" thing, is that it's very easy to get off track. You start making a bit of money, having some fun... it can be hard to get back in a school frame of mind. So you take a couple more years, just to figure out what you want to do... and now you've got a few years experience whereever youy're wiorking... decent money. Certainly more than any student makes. Really hard now to go back.

This is, imo, part of why so many more women than men are getting post-secondary educatins now as well. A man working traditional jobs like construction etc. is a lot more likely to make the kind of money that makes school seem like a bad idea.

   

Yeah, that happens for sure with union jobs. Buddy who just got on with BC Ferries is 19 and driving around a new flashy car, while his friends are in school accumulating debt. Fast forward 20 years. Buddy's is now making signficantly less than his friends and (perhaops more importantly) doesn't get much staisfaction still directing traffic afrter 20 years.



No, not hitch-hiking. Youth hostels, or just living somewheres else for a year.

   

Took 3 years off to sail the high seas before university only to find out the teaching jobs dried up during my time in school and went right back sailing again. Not sure still if it was a waste of time but I did learn a lot about feminazism and herstory studies.

   

I took a few years off in the middle of my degree, and because my pay sucked so much (as a cook at Earl's), it motivated me even more to finish my degree.

   

We have all seen them around the streets and wondered ................., well now you know

A newly evolved breed of homosapiens has been cataloged.



They are referred to as “homo slackass-erectus” created by natural genetic downward evolution through constant spineless posturing and spasmatic upper limb gestures, which new research has shown to cause shorter legs and an inability to ambulate other than in an awkward shuffling gait. The "drag-crotch" shape also seems to affect brain function.
Expect no eye contact or intelligent verbal communication. This species typically receives food stamps and full government care. Unfortunately most are highly fertile.
Homo Slackass-Erectus.jpg [ 37.11 KiB | Viewed 204 times ]

   

   

No major dispute on that. "Life unworthy of life" as the Fuhrer so aptly put it.

   

Seriously tho, here the real basis for the problem. Not just in 'my' industry, but all across the board. Consumers want/expect to 'rake in the big $$$, and spend as little as possible. That is the disconnect.
As an employer I am expected to pay a 'fair-to above average wage. Being that I am self employed I have to get out there and hustle jobs as well as do the work too. Meanwhile my employee/s 'do there 8', and then go home to there families & friends.

Here is a copy of a real ad in my field that I will 'dissect' for you. I have not changed this in any way. The jobsite is in Edmonton. One hour travel each way for me.

Wanted: Kitchen backsplash install
Watch | Share| Print | Report Ad



Date Listed 22-Jan-13
Address Edmonton, AB T6R 2M9, Canada
View map




Hello, looking for a professional backplash installer for a small kitchen. Tiles are supplied only, need labor and must provide darker color grout and adhesive as tiles are brown, bronze in color . Quick, easy one day job to cover a 10 sqft area. Email me your quote, not looking to pay over $200.


Load up the necessary wet-saw/s and tools & supplies, and drive 1 hr into the city. $20.00 fuel each way. I'm automatically down $40.00 from what the customer is willing to pay! Let's not forget about the wer&tear on my vehicle. Every km on the odometer depreciates the resale value of the van.
Also add the cost of supplies;
Adhesive $15.00. Grout $23.00 + GST(and the fact that I have to take the time to go down to the supplier & purchase it. Time is money!)

I arrive at the job and have to haul in all my tools and get everything set up. Drop cloths, water to haul to fill the saw pan, buckets of water for mixing grout/cleaning tools. That's an hour of time. I have yet to just walk into a job site and start working. There is always some 'prep work' to be done first. ie removing silicone, taking off existing trim, pulling out the receptacles. Average time for prep is an hour.

*** I just did one back splash which required me to make 3 trips over 3 days to repair/seal the backsplash before I could even begin to install tiles! Installing those tiles took a12 hours. Mosaic tile are always crooked, and need to be cut free of the backing so they can be straightened out.( I showed this to the customer when I went and first looked at the job "oh my, but yiou can fix them, right?"?) A lot of time and frustration involved. Then I had to leave the tile set overnight, and go back the next day to grout & clean up/pack up tools.***

Back to the ad.

Now I install the tile. I will give the customer the benefit of the doubt & assume that the tile they are supplying are a basic 6x6 which just happens to fit nicely between the countertop & the bottom of the upper cabinets. This space is 'supposed to be' a standard 18 inches. So, with minimal cutting it only takes me 4 hrs to install the tile. Now I have to let the adhesive set up over night. That means another trip. 2 more hours and another $40.00 for gas. Don't forget the 'wear & tear' on my vehicle!
So far, this job has taken the better part of a typical work day for me. That's 12 hrs which normally I am working and making money. So I have 'lost' some of my day, hence I have lost $$$.
Next day, it's another round trip to go back and grout the tile and clean up. Another $40.00!

Time to get paid now. $200.00 Wow!

And we won't worry ourselves that I actually took the necessary 10 years of training to become a Govt Certified Journeyman Master Installer!
basement 013.jpg [ 222.25 KiB | Viewed 79 times ]
basement 011.jpg [ 287.38 KiB | Viewed 85 times ]

   

pssst Yogi. You forgot to re install receptacle cover.

   

That's very interesting Yogi. But everybody wants this. You're a consumer yourself, as is everybody else. As an employer you want to pay the lowest wage you can and still get quality workers. Basically we've started a race to the bottom and there seems to be no way out of that spiral. For your work, there's always somebody who's willing to do it cheaper - because they need the money, or they're willing to do a slop job and the customer might not know any better. We import lots of immigrants so there's always somebody desperate enough to do the job for a bit less.

   

Normally, yes. But for this particular job, the customer told me to leave the receptacles out as she was going to get Sparky to change them.

   

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