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Well, I consider them to be Christian Terrorists, just like you would consider Hamas, Hezbollah or any of those groups to be Terrorists. This debate won't go anyhere, difference of opinion.

The organizations have been active, and they are Christian, thats all that matters, why do you like to pick and choose? Are you so blinded by your patriotism that you can't see your own people being the villeins? We are still on topic and the only person that choses not to acknowledge real facts is you instead you blab about useless shit that holds no meaning so the troll would fit you much better.

All you have said so far is that Quran says this, I proved you wrong on that, you said that Muslims agreed with you, yet you have no proof, you also said that Christian Terrorists aren't in the new, once again proved wrong, You said Bush and Blair are not terrorist well, you might be right then 90% of the world is wrong. How many more times should I prove you wrong before you admit that all you do is use propaganda to get your point across, you have nothing but useless material that is copied and pasted from retarded websites. Come up with something better and maybe then you will be worth my time.

   

And if you wish to be a hammerhead then at least answer the question that was posed and not just be a troll.



The Ummah also refers to lands that were once held by the muslims. Use of the term is, as they say in Mecca, hateful to the infidels.



You are wrong and you are ignorant.



As I said, I do not give a rip how the muslims spell it. I spell Qu'ran t-o-i-l-e-t-p-a-p-e-r and I also call a masjid a mosque for the precise reason that it pisses them off.



Mr. Google, you could simply search the quotes for Abbas or Salad Head on this site and find the proof yourself, wasn't that your advice to me?

   

Where you know so much about them then it should be easy for you to name these organizations and cite some of their atrocities over the past 24 months.

I look forward to seeing your proof to your argument.

   

What question? I am not going to answer stupid questions that are not relevant to the discussion, first you wanted to know Christian Terrorist groups, then you wanted news stories, now you want me to prove what they did in the last 2 years, look for yourself man, you are here to learn and research, I am not doing everything for you.



No It doesn't, what are you talking about? The word Ummah has nothing to do with land, it refers to Muslims as one community, not Muslim lands. Ummah, is more like a Nation without borders, a Muslim in Canada is part of the same Ummah that a Muslim Saudi would be part of, so it has nothing to do with land, get it right already.



No using a Hatred website to get the quotes of Quran is Ignorant.



You can spell Quran which ever way you want, its just you make yourself look like an idiot when you choose to spell it toiletpaper, it only shows how mature you are. Masjid and Mosque are the same thing, Mosque in English, Masjid is more of a traditional word that comes from Arabic. Good job, you finally got something right, wooohoooo.



Hahaha, last post I read by you him, was him ripping you a apart of lots of shit you were saying, I just search the word Abbas and this guy was giving you the exact answers I was. What are you talking about? I don't see him agreeing about anything, let alone your translation of Quran, so now you made the claim, I did the research and you were wrong once again, now find me something that says he agrees with your translation of the Quran.

   

And, if I find you something in the last 24 months, what will you do? will you call yourself an idiot? if you do, I will find ya something from the list I gave you. Otherwise I am not wasting my time for nothing.

   

If you find something of actual substance I'll agree with you. I asked for what I asked for. If you manage to find it I'll agree with you. That simple.

   

Oh, and FYI - as confusing as it may sound to you, Abbas and I are friends.

   

Ahhh yea, that is confusing and Nah, I won't go through the trouble to find you recent activities of Christian Fundamentalists for just "I will agree with you", not good enough. Anyways, I am still waiting for you to show me the translation of the Quran, and where Muslims would agree with you.

   

Uhm, I gave you the name of the particular version of the koran already. Ibn Kathir.

And the reason you cannot come up with any acts of terror by Christian terror groups in the past two years is because there have not been any.

   

Some Holy Books were modified at one point or another in history by "authorised" ppl and for different reasons and in the name of the original authors. Usualy in order to "explain" a certain military and/or political action. That was done in a time when religion was more important than it is now.

In case of the muslims the much debaited Jihad was not a military one. The military one was later added due to political and military reasons by the different philosophical schools. Even when the military Jihad was added there were still other types of Jihad and belive me when i tell you that the military Jihad was seen as the last resort, it was seen as the least glorious one. There were in total i think 4 or 5 types of Jihads. Just because some crazy idiots use the military jihad as a means to an end, it doesen't mean that the muslim religion is bad.

Even the Christian religion was "modified".

It's a long history m8 and in order to sustain your point of view you need more than a few quotes.

Btw, in the Middle Ages the muslim religion was alot more tolerant to other religions than the Christian or Jeweish religion were, simply because the muslims did recognised Jesus as a prophet, just that lesser than Mohamed was, so the quote you posted concerning the intolerance to these religions was probably added after the Middle Ages. This tolerance of course had political, economical and military reasons. This is proof to the modifications the book suffered during the centuries.

Buttom line, i still sustain my point of view when i said that at their origins, religions were about peace and ultimetly they are all about the same God wether they are called muslim religion or jewish religion.

In case you're wondering where i make my statements from, i can assure you they are not from the internet or rummors, they are from books.

Sry for the late reply btw.

   

Allah is no more the God of the Jews than Zeus, Jupiter or Odin are. Allah was the name of the chief god, in the pre Islamic pantheon, worshiped by the arabs.



?? While I'll agree that Christianity was intolerant, at this time, I don't think the Jews had a chance to practice intolerance on anyone.

   

Intolerance was not the point of my statement. First of all, what i ment was that jews did not recognised Christian religion simply because they did not recognised Jesus as a prohet...i think they still don't.

I don't want you to get me wrong: i'm not accusing a religion for being less tolerant than others. What i said in my post was simply ment to point out the fact that during the centuries all religions had their problems with tolerating other religions: in most cases this intolerance was caused by anything BUT ideological differences which were only used as a pretext...and they still are in some cases. Ideological differences were endeed an issue at the beggining of the Christian religion for example, but even than there are situations when it's hard to make a difference between the fight out of sincere faith and the fight for money and land. Somehow these elements seem to meet throughout the history of many religions.

Also, even some of our orthodox priests have learned to accept that all politheistic religions reffer to the same God, which is a remarcable progress. What i said is not an invention of mein btw, but it is considered as a humanistic view (not sure i got the word right) of religion.

In my own personal view: there is no right religion and wrong religion, there is only how you view this religion, wether that religion is your own or another man's religion. Who are we to tell anyone that their religion is wrong and ours is right, just because a moron kills ppl in the name of God. As an Orthodox-Christian i for one have accepted any religion wether it's Jeweish, Catholic, Muslim, Protestant and even the so-called pagan religion who in small circles is still practiced. I've had 4 years to study the history of some of these religions and have learned to ignore the idiots who invoke the name of God or Allah just for their own personal interests and instead focus on the more philosophical meanings that existed at the start.

   

I was raised a Christian, and I tried very hard to be a good Christian. As I got older, I realized that many of the horrors in this world are commited in the name of 'god'. Wars, ethnic cleansing, genocide... I tried to reconcile what I observed with what the church was teaching. Forgive your enemy, love your neighbor... It was all very confusing as a teen. I could never make sense of all the contradictions.

Now as a middle aged man, having thought about it for many years, it is my opinion that it is people who are to blame. Religions all spring from the same place. Primordial fear of death and the unknown. Religions were developed to try to make sense of the unknown, and ease the fear of death. There are those who will use this fear to gain power over the faithful and guide them toward certain goals. Just look at what Jim Jones was able to do. It is even worse when the person who is using religion to control is also a powerful political leader. They convince their followers that things must me done for the common good. The common good is of course equated with the will of whatever deity they worship. No one wants to go against the will of their god.

So in the name of god, we blow up buses full of children, turn whole countries into ruins. Round up all the (insert chosen hated group here) and exterminate them. Things that would normally horrify anyone become the will of god because the man we trust to interpret the holy words says that god wants us to do it.

   

   

Always blame people. Religion can't do anything by itself, it requires people to do something with it. First, people have to create religion, then people have to convert followers, who are also people, to carry out their message.

   

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