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Your hypothesis is that there is no God. Ms. Kuehl is not as possessed of that certainty anymore.

And, actually, I was very calm at the time. It wasn't a threat so much as a rhetorical discussion on my part that was witnessed by a State Police officer. If there were any overt threats they were from Her Ugliness and not me.

I wonder, would you renounce atheism if your life was on the line?

See, I value the facts of the lives of the Apostles who were eyewitnesses to the life of Jesus.

Peter, when offered the choice to walk away a free man by renouncing Jesus or to be crucified upside down freely chose crucifixion. Roman records confirm this.

Paul chose death over renouncing Jesus, as well.

If they had just made him up why would they be so willing to die for a fantasy?

I am not, by any measure, a good Christian. But I have no doubts so far as the life of Jesus or the existence of God goes.

Regardless of anything else, just to have you preach to me about character and morality makes it all worthwhile.

   

Well your bullshit rhetoric doesn't concern me, so you're going to have to try something else.

Lots of people have died for lots of reasons, and that doesn't prove a thing. Does the Heaven's Gate mass suicide sway your opinion at all on the matter of UFOs hiding in Hale-Bopp dust? It's just a contemporary version of the weak-minded 'proof' you've described above.

On topic: this research, the summary of which I posted, has nothing to do with whether or not God exists - it states as much, in fact, in the final paragraph of the full report.

This is a serious matter - people's health is affected by their 'faith' in intercessory prayer, as far as this study has shown. They've put their healing in the incapable hands of the religous.

   

When did this assult begin against Christians in Christian countries? I read 12 forums but post only here and I see a rather alarming trend of Hug a Muslim hate a Christian.

   

No. Renouncing a belief such as that is like renouncing your freedom. It is like renouncing your freedom of speech or die. Anyone who does renounce it is giving up their freedom.

   

Moral & Religious issueses on Canadaka = Christian stomping. Athiests can be just as stubborn as Christians but I find Athiests tend to be more arrogant and mean(I used to be one). Here's my attempt at converting athiests. If you're right well we just rot in the ground but if I'm right then I goto heaven and you goto hell.

   

Well, since we're obviously going off topic:

But my 'freedom' to talk about my atheism isn't the top priority in my life - I've got a family, a girlfriend, friends, and a promising career to look forward to that isn't worth giving up for the chance to say 'there is no god'. Other than the fact that it bugs other people to hear it, the disbelief in God is not a that important to me - it's just a fact.

If someone is holding a gun to my head, I've got nothing to prove to them, and telling them what they want to hear isn't going to change how I feel, or what I know is true. If they want me to renounce Coriolis acceleration, or the Poisson effect, it doesn't really change anything, except in their head. Bart might feel more comfortable knowing that he can scare some dumb lady into agreeing with him, but she'll continue on her way as soon as he's gone, and they're back to where they started.

   

That's just Pascal's wager. Try this:

The next time you get in a car, I have a feeling it will crash and you'll die.

Are you going to risk not believing me?

Note: in this thread so far, two Christians have used bullshit threats/warnings of violence (assuming the stories I've heard of Hell are true) to attempt conversion of Atheists. I've posted medical evidence that some prayer is actually harmful to people, but they've ignored it.

   

Blasphemy! Blasphemy! Blasphemy!

I pray god will smite you all down in ten seconds from reading this....



























....ok never mind.

   

I disagree, giving up any sort of freedom like freedom of religion (or from it in this case) is a fundamental thing. If that is taken away, your other freedoms will be soon to follow.

But you're right, we are off-topic. I agree whole-heartedly with Blue_Nose on this actual subject

   

It's a discussion. It's a freedom. Something people do in this world to explain the unexplainable or for anothers pleasure, entertainment. I hardly see it as Christian (for that matter, why automatically claim it as "Christian") stomping? The second time I've seen somebody on this forum dismiss religious discussion as "anti-Christian". The period of the enlightenment in history must be your favourite subject. People actually thinking for themselves.

I find your post dismissive and arrogant, am I going to assume all religious folk dismissive and arrogant? For that matter, I don't think your own experience pertains to all atheists' behaviour.

   

Well, there's a difference between giving up a freedom, and renouncing it for a person holding a gun to your face in an isolated incident. If the gun was held to my head indefinitely, forcing me to go to church and eat Jesus' body and all that crap, then yes, I'd refuse, and face the consequences.

   

Ah fair enough, I was thinking the second example, not the first.

   

I knew I should'nt have said hell. Thats just the line I use when people attack my beliefs.

   

I meant most of the threads under Morals & religious issues are anti-Christian(or Muslim).

   

Exactly how are they anti-Christian (heck, most are anti-Muslim so they don't count)?

   

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