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To all the sympathizers of these guys

BYE BYE have fun in Jail

   

That guy joined the army, he wasn't drafted.82nd Airborne, no less. How come he didn't ask for CO status? Sounds to me like he joined the army without thinking about the fact he may have to actually fight. Too bad, So sad, sucks to be him.

   

This is just another example of how society's moral fabric is coming apart at the seams. This little whiner refused to own up to his responsibilities like a man, and instead fled to canada and tried to abuse the courts to get out of performing his service.

I do hope he will spend the next several (dozen) years in a 5x10 cell, regretting his idiocy and cowardice. He gives the army a bad name.

   

He did apply for CO status but was denied. And he did fight in Afghanistan and was set to be deployed to Iraq when he desterted.

   

During the Viet Nam era, Canada welcomed and gave refuge to our cowards, draft dodgers and deserters. I recently read where some Canuks are building a monument to this scum and claims they have become valued citizens of Canada. What does this say about the rest of you?

   

Hey don't put me in that group.

   

Not saying that some haven't become valued citizens, but I really don't know of any. That being said the Canadian Vietnam Veterans I believe have already put an end to the monument......and rightfully so!

   

It says nothing, I wouldn't judge you based on what Dubya did.

   

elk6x6 -- The monument in question was proposed for Nelson BC. The outcry from those who disagreed, myself included, brought the whole idea to an end. I believe the mayor of Nelson is still trying to empty his computer of the nasty emails and wade through the paper. I have no doubt that the media in your country only told the side of the story that would elicit a violent reaction. The results of a mass letter-writing campaign to stop the project is not going to make Fox News.

In answer to your question, it says this is a free country. A majority of Canadians disagreed then and disagree now with harbouring US deserters and draft-dodgers, the latest case having been rejected and the US Army deserter ordered deported. Your hostility in your question indicates you are unaware of that. Careful, lest someone fire a similar rocket in your direction.

Hwacker -- Nice move. Instead of answering you simply run for cover.

   

Yeah i ran alright. and it did make Fox News FYI.

   

Didn't Mohammed Ali aka: Cassius Clay do time for dodging the draft.
I do recall he came to Canada.

You wanna call him a Coward?

   

He did his time in a US jail. He did visit Canada but didn't come here to avoid the draft. There are a few Vietnam Vets that have no problem with him because he paid the price in full by doing the time. That opinion is one only Veteran can have.

   

He stood up for his beliefs...


That is all I need.

   

The problem as I see it is that your in an organization that works because people obey orders. YET, they are accountable for their actions, even when following orders. If they are to be accountable, they must be able to say NO. If it is wrong they should not do it.

Perhaps they are traitors to their country, but they may have still done the right thing.

This is no different than a German soldier fleeing Germany in WW2 because they didn't want to murder jews.

So either you are held accountable (eventually) for war crimes or you become a traitor to a nation committing those crimes.

Cheers,

K

   

A soldier cannot be held responsible for engaging in aggressive war; Only a government in power at the time can be made to account for that.

A soldier is required to obey orders inasmuch as they are legal. He/she CAN be held responsible for violations of personal conduct and the conduct of those under his/her command during the prosecution of a war, whether it is deemed legal or not. If ordered to shoot a prisoner, for example, they simply have to refuse. If one is at risk to themselves for not obeying the order, the US armed services has many avenues to apprehend and prosecute those who would issue such orders.

The United States has a volunteer armed forces. Regardless of the "fine print" that so many seem unable to read or comprehend, none of the members of the US armed services are there without having offered themselves for service. None of them were conscripted and none were compelled to serve outside the limits of the agreements into which they entered.

In that THEY didn't start the war in Iraq, that they are serving voluntarily, that they swore an oath, desertion cannot be excused, nor can another country declare desertion morally proper.

It's also interesting that some of these sudden "conscientious objectors" suddenly developed this elevated moral posture when their unit was given the warning order to move, but not before. They CAN say NO, but not to lawful commands, and being ordered to fight, no matter how legal the cause, is a completely lawful command. They are hot-to-trot soldiers... as long as there are no bullets whizzing past their ears.

The German analogy is inaccurate at the least. It has been a thoroughly researched fact that German soldiers who expressed their objections to murder were pulled out of units in which such activity took place.

   

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