Liberal Party Civil War comes out into the open
HyperionTheEvil @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 5:33 am
$1:
Stephane Dion's palace guard was under seige Thursday by members of his own party calling on the Liberal leader to dismiss one of his closest aides over alleged remarks about Quebec.
Several MPs and senators from the province have been pleading privately for him to fire Jamie Carroll, the Liberals' national director and one of the key players in Dion's leadership victory.
They are now making their demands public.
Witnesses at a closed-door meeting this week say Carroll was dismissive when some Quebec Liberals suggested their leader's entourage needed more people who were bilingual and from the province.
According to witnesses Carroll remarked that if he hired more Quebecers, then he'd have to hire more Chinese.
Carroll says the conversation has been mischaracterized and twisted out of context.
But some of his outraged colleagues still want him gone.
"I called party headquarters to tell them we can't tolerate that in this party,'' Montreal MP Pablo Rodriguez said in an interview.
"I don't see how Mr. Carroll could remain in his role with comments like that.''
If Dion didn't have enough headaches with his party's woeful fundraising, poor recent byelection results, and a possible federal election approaching, he now has to deal with a public war between members of his party and one of his top organizers.
Carroll said in a statement he never meant to insult Quebecers, or Chinese-Canadians.
He said he agrees with increasing the number of francophone Quebecers working in the national office, but also believes the party must reflect Canada's growing diversity.
But the head of the Liberals' Quebec wing also wants Carroll gone.
Robert Fragasso says party members support Dion, but adds that the leader is not a populist and he needs more contact with ground-level organizers from his home province.
Fragasso was at the meeting with Carroll where the exchange on the subject came up. The remarks from the national director, he said, will divide the party and pit francophone Quebecers against anglophones.
"I informed our party president -- (Marie) Poulin -- that very night that I would demand his resignation,'' he said.
"We can't ask a national director who holds such a scornful attitude and who has such retrograde ideas toward Quebec to be the person who unites everyone leading toward the next election. Come on.''
Party president Marie Poulin was also quoted by the Journal de Montreal newspaper saying Carroll made a joke at the meeting and she didn't find it funny.
Another senior Quebec Liberal says party stalwart Denis Coderre was livid and also asked national headquarters to remove Carroll. Coderre refused to be interviewed.
But that senior Liberal says that the one-line crack about hiring Quebecers is only the latest cause for annoyance with Carroll, and that several key Liberals have already tried urging Dion to dump him.
He questioned Carroll's understanding of the Elections Act and bemoaned the party's woeful fundraising record.
Party sources last May said deputy leader Michael Ignatieff tried urging Dion to dump Carroll.
Although displeased with Carroll's public musings, sources said Dion indicated that he would not fire his hand-picked choice for the party's top administrative post.
Ignatieff was incensed by comments from Carroll in a new book, "Against the Current.''
In it, Carroll expressed doubts about Dion's decision to extend an olive branch to his former leadership rivals and said he loses sleep at night worrying about how they might undermine the leader.
The Tories wasted little time in joining the flock criticizing one of Dion's top lieutenants.
"Carroll made some really bizarre, eye-raising remarks. Apparently Liberals themselves find them, at best, distasteful,'' said Conservative cabinet minister Jason Kenney.
"He seems to be insulting two different groups at the same time, showing terribly bad judgment.
"This doesn't reflect well on Stephane Dion, who should hold this guy accountable.''
Several MPs and senators from the province have been pleading privately for him to fire Jamie Carroll, the Liberals' national director and one of the key players in Dion's leadership victory.
They are now making their demands public.
Witnesses at a closed-door meeting this week say Carroll was dismissive when some Quebec Liberals suggested their leader's entourage needed more people who were bilingual and from the province.
According to witnesses Carroll remarked that if he hired more Quebecers, then he'd have to hire more Chinese.
Carroll says the conversation has been mischaracterized and twisted out of context.
But some of his outraged colleagues still want him gone.
"I called party headquarters to tell them we can't tolerate that in this party,'' Montreal MP Pablo Rodriguez said in an interview.
"I don't see how Mr. Carroll could remain in his role with comments like that.''
If Dion didn't have enough headaches with his party's woeful fundraising, poor recent byelection results, and a possible federal election approaching, he now has to deal with a public war between members of his party and one of his top organizers.
Carroll said in a statement he never meant to insult Quebecers, or Chinese-Canadians.
He said he agrees with increasing the number of francophone Quebecers working in the national office, but also believes the party must reflect Canada's growing diversity.
But the head of the Liberals' Quebec wing also wants Carroll gone.
Robert Fragasso says party members support Dion, but adds that the leader is not a populist and he needs more contact with ground-level organizers from his home province.
Fragasso was at the meeting with Carroll where the exchange on the subject came up. The remarks from the national director, he said, will divide the party and pit francophone Quebecers against anglophones.
"I informed our party president -- (Marie) Poulin -- that very night that I would demand his resignation,'' he said.
"We can't ask a national director who holds such a scornful attitude and who has such retrograde ideas toward Quebec to be the person who unites everyone leading toward the next election. Come on.''
Party president Marie Poulin was also quoted by the Journal de Montreal newspaper saying Carroll made a joke at the meeting and she didn't find it funny.
Another senior Quebec Liberal says party stalwart Denis Coderre was livid and also asked national headquarters to remove Carroll. Coderre refused to be interviewed.
But that senior Liberal says that the one-line crack about hiring Quebecers is only the latest cause for annoyance with Carroll, and that several key Liberals have already tried urging Dion to dump him.
He questioned Carroll's understanding of the Elections Act and bemoaned the party's woeful fundraising record.
Party sources last May said deputy leader Michael Ignatieff tried urging Dion to dump Carroll.
Although displeased with Carroll's public musings, sources said Dion indicated that he would not fire his hand-picked choice for the party's top administrative post.
Ignatieff was incensed by comments from Carroll in a new book, "Against the Current.''
In it, Carroll expressed doubts about Dion's decision to extend an olive branch to his former leadership rivals and said he loses sleep at night worrying about how they might undermine the leader.
The Tories wasted little time in joining the flock criticizing one of Dion's top lieutenants.
"Carroll made some really bizarre, eye-raising remarks. Apparently Liberals themselves find them, at best, distasteful,'' said Conservative cabinet minister Jason Kenney.
"He seems to be insulting two different groups at the same time, showing terribly bad judgment.
"This doesn't reflect well on Stephane Dion, who should hold this guy accountable.''
Liberal bloodletting from CTV
I love it when Liberals not only screw things up, but start cutting each others throats, it shows Canadians just how usless they and the looney left here is in Canada.
Can you say Conservative majority?....i knew you could
ryan29 @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:01 am
think there is a bit of a power struggle in the liberal party , there are still some who would like the leaders job for themself .
and the other positions which come with it there friends want , this all leads to fighting .
manutd707 @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:26 am
Rediculous, you know he might have just made an offhand comment and not meant anything by it. How many times could be said the same of anyone else? Lots.
But its pretty sad that they use things like this to position themselves inside their own party for more power, bigger desk or hotter secretary.. whatever it is.
gg teamwork from our government. Way to have each others backs.
sasquatch2 @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 8:47 am
With an election looming, this an indication that Canada's most corupt but most adept politicians have wandered away/fled from the LPC.
Freakinoldguy @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 8:21 pm
manutd707 manutd707:
But its pretty sad that they use things like this to position themselves inside their own party for more power, bigger desk or hotter secretary.. whatever it is.
It's been that way in the LP of Canada since Lester Pearson brought in the highly touted "three wise men", who as it turned out fell to the wayside one by one, except, PET who then turned out to be the most reviled Prime Minister in Canadian history.
So, it appears that 40 years of political evolution hasn't changed the LPC one iota, they're still in there, back stabbing whining, and positioning themselves for better portfolios and personal perks while spouting the old Lib adage, were the only party that cares about the people and the welfare of Canada.
If it wasn't so pathetic, it would be nauseating, wouldn't it.
Streaker @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 8:30 pm
Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:
PET who then turned out to be the most reviled Prime Minister in Canadian history.
Dream on.
DerbyX @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 8:34 pm
Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:
manutd707 manutd707:
But its pretty sad that they use things like this to position themselves inside their own party for more power, bigger desk or hotter secretary.. whatever it is.
It's been that way in the LP of Canada since Lester Pearson brought in the highly touted "three wise men", who as it turned out fell to the wayside one by one, except, PET who then turned out to be the most reviled Prime Minister in Canadian history.
So, it appears that 40 years of political evolution hasn't changed the LPC one iota, they're still in there, back stabbing whining, and positioning themselves for better portfolios and personal perks while spouting the old Lib adage, were the only party that cares about the people and the welfare of Canada.
If it wasn't so pathetic, it would be nauseating, wouldn't it.
yeah not.
Trudeau was #3 of the greatest canadian list. You obviously mispelt "reviled".
Its spelled "Respected".
The rest of your post is less then truthful. The Liberals have indeed given Canada great leadership. Thats why they were elected for so many (so many) years.
As for political backstabbing lets take a moment and reflect.
The western value leaning Social Credit party is long gone.
The Liberals defeated them.
The PC party imploded on the political infighting of its own members civil war.
The Liberals defeated them.
Along came the Alliance & Reform parties. hmmmmm, where are they now?
They were reorganized into the first galactic empir...., sorry, the CPC.
The Liberals defeated both of them.
Along comes the CPC under the charasmatic leadership of a Toronto raised Calgarian. Public backless (and ungreatfulness) narrowly defeats the Liberals allowing a CPC minority gov't.
Recent political infighting (very common) seems to have convinced you guys that the Liberals will show the same endemic disloyalty that has plagued conservative parties.
It won't.
Freakinoldguy @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:18 pm
My mistake guy's, PET actually was actually voted the "Worst Canadian" so please accept my apologies. Maybe it was only Mulroney and myself who considered Trudeau the most reviled. But that's another story.
Now that I have given my apology, you can drift peacefully back into your dream world, you know the one where, the Liberal Party of Canada is the most cohesive group of intelectuals in the country and are only concerned with the welfare of Canada, not their own inflated political aspirations, Dion included.
BTW, before you criticise anyone's spelling perhaps you could tell me WTF's a spelt????
DerbyX @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:23 pm
Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:
My mistake guy's, PET actually was actually voted the "Worst Canadian" so please accept my apologies. Maybe it was only Mulroney and myself who considered Trudeau the most reviled. But that's another story.
Now that I have given my apology, you can drift peacefully back into your dream world, you know the one where, the Liberal Party of Canada is the most cohesive group of intelectuals in the country and are only concerned with the welfare of Canada, not their own inflated political aspirations, Dion included.
BTW, before you criticise anyone's spelling perhaps you could tell me WTF's a spelt????
Now that I have given my apology, you can drift peacefully back into your dream world, you know the one where, the Liberal Party of Canada is the most cohesive group of intelectuals in the country and are only concerned with the welfare of Canada, not their own inflated political aspirations, Dion included.
BTW, before you criticise anyone's spelling perhaps you could tell me WTF's a spelt????
Spelled. My bad.
neopundit @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:25 pm
Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:
BTW, before you criticise anyone's spelling perhaps you could tell me WTF's a spelt????
You don't see it very often, but spelt is correct there.
hwacker @ Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:32 pm
whats he talking about wheat ?
sasquatch2 @ Sat Sep 29, 2007 8:19 am
DerbyX
$1:
The Liberals defeated them.
Along came the Alliance & Reform parties. hmmmmm, where are they now?
They were reorganized into the first galactic empir...., sorry, the CPC.
The Liberals defeated both of them.
Along came the Alliance & Reform parties. hmmmmm, where are they now?
They were reorganized into the first galactic empir...., sorry, the CPC.
The Liberals defeated both of them.
And then howcum are the LIBRANO's now siting in opposition? Some defeat?
DerbyX
$1:
Along comes the CPC under the charasmatic leadership of a Toronto raised Calgarian. Public backless (and ungreatfulness) narrowly defeats the Liberals allowing a CPC minority gov't.
HA HA HAW HEE HA HA HAW HEE HA HA HAW HEE HA HA HAW HEE HA HA HAW HEE
Don't get too bold now. The poll here is more represented of stupid implacable partisanship than public opinion. Interesting when the LIBRANOs here usually complain this is a right wing/Con site.
This is not a concession that the LIBRANOs lost the confidence of the Canadians but an accusation that the Canadian voters are ungrateful for failing to support the "atmosphere of entitlement" of the LIBRANOs.
Why do I get the impression you would vote for a red assed baboon if he wore a LIBRANO armband.
HOCKEY PUCK
ridenrain @ Sat Sep 29, 2007 9:19 am
We need a new banner "now on tap: Liberal Kool-Aid."
DerbyX @ Sat Sep 29, 2007 11:34 am
ridenrain ridenrain:
We need a new banner "now on tap: Liberal Kool-Aid."
It comes in 9 exciting flavours.
Now your Conservative kool-aid comes in just the same old corrupt flavour every year.
canada_bruno @ Mon Oct 01, 2007 8:49 am
DerbyX DerbyX:
ridenrain ridenrain:
We need a new banner "now on tap: Liberal Kool-Aid."
It comes in 9 exciting flavours.
Now your Conservative kool-aid comes in just the same old corrupt flavour every year.
What does that mean???? That you never know what you're getting when you vote Liberal?
Take the partisan shots out of it for a moment. Lots of people can identify themselves as liberal or Liberal, but to even consider putting this current gang at the LPC back into power is ridiculous. The LPC needs to clean house. They had their opportunity and missed it when they made Dion leader. The Liberals are not a valid alternative to the CPC to form government at this point in time. Not even close.