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only if you were the burglar

   

Strange thing I have always firmly believed in the right to bear arms. Oddly enough I have had a reason to re-think that. The thing is I now realize I would shoot to kill. The problem in that is I may protect myself but not all crimes perpetrated against you deserve a death sentence. A sentence yes. At the time you may very well want that person dead. In an odd way I think you would only victimize yourself again. You are the victim of the crime perpetrated against you, then having to live with the death by your hands of someone by far not innocent, yet not having perpetrated a crime worthy of death.

   

You wouldn't want to take that bet.

   

oh I fucking would

   

I wasn't cherry picking. You implied that Canada was safe despite harsh gun laws and I merely demonstrated that there are places with almost no gun laws that are demonstrably safer.

Iraq has tapering levels of terror/political violence but has actually very low levels of burglaries, robberies, and etc. Absent the terror/political violence Iraq is a pretty peaceful place and, yes, they all carry real, full-auto AK-47's and all sorts of things that would make most of the wimps in Ottawa wet their pants.

Japan is not a valid argument either for or against gun laws because Japan simply does not compare to any other culture on the planet.

There's little crime in Japan simply because most Japanese would not even consider doing something that might shame their family. Shame being a concept that the good liberals have worked hard to eradicate from our cultures.

Japan also uses gun control to prevent a rise in militarism and, in contrast to our societies, the Japanese citizenry have NEVER had the right to keep and bear arms.

I'd recommend reading The Japanese by Edwin O. Reischauer - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edwin_O._Reischauer if you'd really like to get a grasp of the unique nature of the Japanese culture and how it is incomparable to any other culture.

   

1) I didn't say that it was the safest so the comparison point is mute. Switzerland may indeed be safer but there are factors that do not correlate only to gun control.

2) We can both list nations that "prove" our point but they all have additional factors that must be taken into consideration.

From my charts, for instance, The UK has higher crime but lower homicides then the US. Even that stat cannot be directly linked to gun control despite the fact that it suggest just that.

I compared the US & Canada because all factors taken into considerations they are as close as possible with repect to lifestyle, culture, socio-economics, population demographics, and educational systems.

In other words we can minimze the uncontrolled variables. Vancouver is similiar to Seattle. Toronto is similiar to New York. etc.

In that regard we see that Canada has lower instances of crime rates on a country scale despite our so-called lax penal system and gun control. It seems that we are doing something right and the idea that arming the Canadian public would make us safer is an argument I believe holds no water.

I'm all for freedom to own guns but the argument that society is better off is just not supportable.

Given the belief that criminals just love our lax system and unarmed populace seems to be refuted by the fact that crime stats don't reflect this. If it were true then our crime would get higher and higher until we were forced to take action. It isn't.

Now we get the alarmists who everytime they hear about a shooting on Dundas claim Toronto is as bad as bagdad aught to actually go to bagdad to make a fair judgement.

Gun control may not lower crime but neither does omni gun ownership.

   

Self defence is illegal in the UK. Last year the Parliament had considered revoking the laws that make self-defence illegal and the legislation got tabled.

MP Stephen Pound is the person most responsible for the series of laws that have effectively outlawed self-defence in the UK. I personally debated him on The Tom Sullivan Show several years ago on his lunatic ideas and he very clearly said that defending oneself from a criminal is "barbaric and worse than the crime itself".

Here's Mr. Pound for you:

http://www.iamanenglishman.com/page.php ... rentId=691



It did.

   

What? Are you completely insane? Iraq is one of the most violent places on earth. As for robbery and burglary, there isn't mkuch of a functioning government, so I doubt that anyone is capable of even tracking such statistics. What do you mean "apart from the terror/political violence?" That's like saying "Apart from that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?"

   

Santa isn't real. He had every right to kill that burgler.

   

Just to draw attention to how unreal Japan crime statistics are to the rest of the world:

Probably the main reason why crime in Japan is so small is that they have a 99.9% conviction rate and they still have capital punishment. Their system is screwed, You bleat on about the poor innocent 1% in the US, when their conviction rate is only 85%.

http://129.3.20.41/eps/le/papers/9907/9907001.pdf

With Crime, like politics, image is reality. Telling Canadians that crime is down isn't helping when Vancouver faces some of the worst property crime in North America. Even the guy who runs this website had his car ripped off, probably by an addict who stole a fer cars that day.
What we are doing now isn't working.

   

Get a brain will ya. The entire gist of my argument was that you can't just pick nations to compare without so method of standardizing all the unkown variables.

In addition, this is an ongoing debate between Bart and I over multiple threads and years so some info we have both established already.

Assholes like you with no remorse for those "poor bastards" who are wrongly convicted deserve to get sent up the river for a false kiddie porn charge. A few years in general populace desperately trying to convince people of your innocence might teach you some humanity.

In addition, if you can't see the inherent stupidity of picking a crime ridden area or pointing out someone had his car ripped off in a thread comparing macro crime rates and statistics between to countries with an eye on specific variables then clearly you need even further schooling in reasoning.

Sure telling the victims of crime in Canada that crime is down seems like mockery to them but the same can be said about telling crime victims in the US that "guns protect them" when they have been the victim of a crime.

Are you so desperate to beat me in a debate that you aren't even bothering to read fully or think logically because your response smacks of some right-wing fanatic misinterpreting what he thinks is a bleeding heart hug the criminals argument.

For the record my argument is: Lax gun laws, increased gun ownership and harsh criminal penalties won't decrease crime in Canada. As evidence I offer the fact of Canadas lower crime rates then the US despite their harsher penal system and vastly increased gun ownership.

BTW, what we are doing is working. The criminals don't rule the streets and by and large Canadians liver in a safe and just society even if some individuals haven't.

   

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