Breaking: Epstein found dead in jail cell
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raydan @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 10:54 am
For Epstein...
...correct me if I'm wrong.
If he'd gone to trial, he could have "pleaded the fifth" or guilty.
If he took the fifth, the trial goes on and the only thing that changes is that Epstein doesn't talk, incriminating himself or pointing the finger at others. Proof comes out and witnesses could be called though.
If he pleads guilty, case closes... no proof needed and no witnesses called.
2 questions
Since a witness can incriminate himself, can they plead the fifth?
If Epstein pleads guilty, is everything sealed?
DrCaleb @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:01 am
raydan raydan:
2 questions
Since a witness can incriminate himself, can they plead the fifth?
If Epstein pleads guilty, is everything sealed?
Since a witness can incriminate himself, can they plead the fifth?
If Epstein pleads guilty, is everything sealed?
You don't have to plead "the 5th" in your own trial, there is no requirement for you to testify against yourself in the first place.
Evidence in trials is almost always public, unless the judge seals parts to protect victims.
stratos @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:03 am
In a trial the accused does not have to take the stand the prosecution can not force him or her to do so. Once a person gives their testimony they can be cross examined by the other side. Thus in cases where a witness may have aided or been a small part of a crime yet the prosecution is going after the big guy the cut a plea bargain or deal with the lesser criminal who agrees to it and gives testimony. Witnesses thus don't have to do a plead the fifth while on the stand.
Is that what you are asking about?
$1:
If he pleads guilty, case closes... no proof needed and no witnesses called.
Some times they make the guilty party state exactly what they did as part of the guilty plea. Don't recall the legal term for that. Might have applied to this case.
DrCaleb covered the reason why testimony and or evidence would be sealed for a case like this.
DrCaleb @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:05 am
stratos stratos:
Some times they make the guilty party state exactly what they did as part of the guilty plea. Don't recall the legal term for that. Might have applied to this case.
In Canada, it's "agreed statement of facts". Generally it's "Admission of Guilt".
Sunnyways @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:56 am
stratos stratos:
Some times they make the guilty party state exactly what they did as part of the guilty plea. Don't recall the legal term for that. Might have applied to this case.
DrCaleb covered the reason why testimony and or evidence would be sealed for a case like this.
In Law and Order, that part of the show is called the allocution:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allocution
Martin15 @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:11 pm
Sunnyways Sunnyways:
In Law and Order, that part of the show is called the allocution:
The bullshit circus swirling around this one will make the TV show
look like a solid evidence based documentary.
On watch,not on watch, suicide, murder, guards were there, guards not there,
guards were tired. cameras didn't work, the bullshit meter will be off the scale.
All planned.
raydan @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:28 pm
That's what they want you to think. 
stratos @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:51 pm
I do hope that his death somehow allows his victims to sleep a little better at night. Don't think it will but I do hope it does.
xerxes @ Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:05 pm
stratos @ Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:53 am
Yep the above is the attitude of some of those fine upstanding guards I worked with.
DrCaleb @ Thu Aug 15, 2019 6:34 am
$1:
Epstein autopsy finds multiple broken neck bones, raising questions about cause of death
An autopsy found that financier Jeffrey Epstein sustained multiple breaks in his neck bones, according to two people familiar with the findings, deepening the mystery about the circumstances around his death.
Among the bones broken in Epstein’s neck was the hyoid bone, which in men is near the Adam’s apple. Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said.
The details are the first findings to emerge from the autopsy of Epstein, a convicted sex offender and multimillionaire in federal custody on charges of sex trafficking. He died early Saturday morning after guards found him hanging in his cell at the Metropolitan Correctional Center in Manhattan and he could not be revived.
Attorney General William Barr, whose department oversees the Bureau of Prisons facility where Epstein died, has described his death as an “apparent suicide.” Justice officials declined to comment on the new information from Epstein’s autopsy.
An autopsy found that financier Jeffrey Epstein sustained multiple breaks in his neck bones, according to two people familiar with the findings, deepening the mystery about the circumstances around his death.
Among the bones broken in Epstein’s neck was the hyoid bone, which in men is near the Adam’s apple. Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said.
The details are the first findings to emerge from the autopsy of Epstein, a convicted sex offender and multimillionaire in federal custody on charges of sex trafficking. He died early Saturday morning after guards found him hanging in his cell at the Metropolitan Correctional Center in Manhattan and he could not be revived.
Attorney General William Barr, whose department oversees the Bureau of Prisons facility where Epstein died, has described his death as an “apparent suicide.” Justice officials declined to comment on the new information from Epstein’s autopsy.
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/typ ... strangling
llama66 @ Thu Aug 15, 2019 7:18 am
Great, now they'll find the guy who killed Epstein dead after he shot himself in the face. 6 times.
DrCaleb @ Thu Aug 15, 2019 7:19 am
He went out for a jog, and someone shot him in Central Park.
GreenTiger @ Thu Aug 15, 2019 7:41 am
DrCaleb DrCaleb:
$1:
Epstein autopsy finds multiple broken neck bones, raising questions about cause of death
An autopsy found that financier Jeffrey Epstein sustained multiple breaks in his neck bones, according to two people familiar with the findings, deepening the mystery about the circumstances around his death.
Among the bones broken in Epstein’s neck was the hyoid bone, which in men is near the Adam’s apple. Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said.
The details are the first findings to emerge from the autopsy of Epstein, a convicted sex offender and multimillionaire in federal custody on charges of sex trafficking. He died early Saturday morning after guards found him hanging in his cell at the Metropolitan Correctional Center in Manhattan and he could not be revived.
Attorney General William Barr, whose department oversees the Bureau of Prisons facility where Epstein died, has described his death as an “apparent suicide.” Justice officials declined to comment on the new information from Epstein’s autopsy.
An autopsy found that financier Jeffrey Epstein sustained multiple breaks in his neck bones, according to two people familiar with the findings, deepening the mystery about the circumstances around his death.
Among the bones broken in Epstein’s neck was the hyoid bone, which in men is near the Adam’s apple. Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said.
The details are the first findings to emerge from the autopsy of Epstein, a convicted sex offender and multimillionaire in federal custody on charges of sex trafficking. He died early Saturday morning after guards found him hanging in his cell at the Metropolitan Correctional Center in Manhattan and he could not be revived.
Attorney General William Barr, whose department oversees the Bureau of Prisons facility where Epstein died, has described his death as an “apparent suicide.” Justice officials declined to comment on the new information from Epstein’s autopsy.
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/typ ... strangling
This might be called an “assisted suicide” in certain circles.
Martin15 @ Thu Aug 15, 2019 8:31 am
GreenTiger GreenTiger:
This might be called an “assisted suicide” in certain circles.
What ?
Noooooooooooo.
He killed himself by hitting himself in the back of the head with a blunt force
object 3 times after breaking 4 vertebrae with a piece of paper.
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