Should Canada become a member of the EU?
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SprCForr @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:13 pm
No poll on CKA is accurate. Anyone who's been a member since coffee break knows how to skew the results.
Best just to leave them out.
sasquatch2 @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:24 pm
$1:
I prefer Brussels than Moscow and Beijing. Beijing is a gonna be a real threat in sometime. Wait until the summer Olympics this year. You will see what I meant
That ain't saying much. I have more experience with the ancien regime than you due to your tender years. I recall one night on the Moscow subway, the train stopping and the occupants ordered off..."Davi davi". While still on the platform a shout of "stoy", I instantly interpreted and hit the deck. The Muscovites beat me to the deck....
Beijing certainly will be interesting if visibilty is limited to 25 metres.
Brenda @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 12:32 pm
Congio Congio:
Runing away is action. Hey, I have nothing to you or your decision. It was a very good one. Canada is the best country on this planet.
But action is not necessarily running away.$1:
Today there is no need for Canada to unify with Europe. But when China and other non western countries gain in power and begin to mess in Canada's and Europe's affairs, there will be a need for a union.
Why? Why would there be more need for a union?
$1:
Just be prepared for what is about to come. We will see in 30 years if I, and my professors, and S.P. Huntington were right 
Why do you think I left the EU? I prepared myself for what was coming, and I was right. Don't forget, the process for a not-Canadian citizen to get a visa is a long one...
The decision to apply for it is even a longer one.
Congio @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:52 pm
sasquatch2 sasquatch2:
$1:
I prefer Brussels than Moscow and Beijing. Beijing is a gonna be a real threat in sometime. Wait until the summer Olympics this year. You will see what I meant
That ain't saying much. I have more experience with the ancien regime than you due to your tender years. I recall one night on the Moscow subway, the train stopping and the occupants ordered off..."Davi davi". While still on the platform a shout of "stoy", I instantly interpreted and hit the deck. The Muscovites beat me to the deck....
Beijing certainly will be interesting if visibilty is limited to 25 metres.
Once in Moscow doesn't top 13 years in Poland, eh?
===================================================
Brenda Brenda:
Congio Congio:
Runing away is action. Hey, I have nothing to you or your decision. It was a very good one. Canada is the best country on this planet.
But action is not necessarily running away.I know. It is an option.
Brenda Brenda:
$1:
Today there is no need for Canada to unify with Europe. But when China and other non western countries gain in power and begin to mess in Canada's and Europe's affairs, there will be a need for a union.
Why? Why would there be more need for a union?
It is quite simple. Let us use an example:
When colonists arrived in North America they were organized. First nastions, except the Iroquois, were just small tribes. European colonists fought each tribe one by one, so it was very easy. Image how would history look like if all the North American Natives have united against the European colonial powers? Maybe there would be no USA and Canada, but Native Americans States.
Chinese are 1.3 billion, Hindus are 1.2 billion, Muslims are 1 billion, Europeans and North Americans are not even a billion.
What made European states and America super powers in XIX and XX century was technologies and wealth. Today all other civilizations are gaining on wealth and have even better technologies. If you don't want China to be the number 1 super power that will mess into European and North American affairs, we should unite.
And it will happen. But, the breathe of China is not felt by everyone in the West yet.
Brenda Brenda:
Why do you think I left the EU? I prepared myself for what was coming, and I was right. Don't forget, the process for a not-Canadian citizen to get a visa is a long one...
The decision to apply for it is even a longer one.
The decision to apply for it is even a longer one.
My parents told me everything about it
harzer_knaller @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 4:51 pm
Would be way easier for me travelling to Canada if you join the EU 
mixedfarmer @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:03 pm
why would we want to?
Congio @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:29 pm
harzer_knaller harzer_knaller:
Would be way easier for me travelling to Canada if you join the EU
Ja, das is was ich glaube auch!
Toro @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:58 pm
They wouldn't want us.
Congio @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 6:07 pm
Toro Toro:
They wouldn't want us.
That's an other topic
Andem @ Thu Feb 28, 2008 7:14 pm
Congio Congio:
Voila:
Cultural
- Canada could protect it's Franco-British heritage from Americanization.
Cultural
- Canada could protect it's Franco-British heritage from Americanization.
Canada doesn't have Franco-British culture. It has a culture based on the people who came to populate the land. It's changed a lot since then.
$1:
- Quebec and all other Francophones, as I know, would be more pleased with the EU than American Union
Of course they are. Didn't you know it's cool to be anti-American? Pfft.
Furthermore, Quebec has retained a little more of their European-rooted culture than the ROC has.
$1:
- Canada and Canadians could profit more from European culture.
Canada's already happy destroying what culture they have left. Last time I was in Toronto, mainstream Canadian culture was further marginalised by places such as Chinatown and Brampton.
$1:
Politicaly
- Canada by choosing Europe would give a message: We decided on our own that we want to be with Europe, not the US
- Canada by choosing Europe would give a message: We decided on our own that we want to be with Europe, not the US
I don't think any Canadians who know much about Europe want to be part of it. There's been a separation of so long and Canadian are closer to US culture than European culture.
$1:
- Canada thanks to it's potential would be an important member of the EU
- Canada would gain European and international respect thanks to the role it could play.
- Canada would gain European and international respect thanks to the role it could play.
Other people replying to this thread have touched on this point. Canada would have no real voting power and would ultimately be giving up sovereignty to its natural resources.
$1:
Economy
- Many services on the line Canada Europe would become cheaper. Students could have free education in Europe
- Many services on the line Canada Europe would become cheaper. Students could have free education in Europe
As a German taxpayer, I don't want to subsidise Canadians who want to study for free in Germany; not anymore than I want to subsidise Poland whos government is a real pain in the arse for us. Talk about ungreatful.
$1:
- Canada could be more independent economically from the US by having a bigger trade with the US
Totally the opposite. See my point above regarding sovereignty.
$1:
- There would be more immigrants of European descent.
Canada doesn't want immigrants of European descent. They want third worlders as slave-labourers to replace the current population.
Congio Congio:
Europe is the one that can learn from Canada. Canada is the best example in the world of multiculturalism and cooperation of people of different backgrounds, faiths, and beliefs.
Canada is the absolute WORST example of multiculturalism I've ever come across in my entire life. Brasil, along with some other South American countries are probably the best, and I'd never want to live there.
Congio Congio:
To gain Polish citizenship is very hard. Harder than Canadian.
Are you serious? Harder than Polish citizenship? A Canadian passport, sadly, is one notch up from a crackerjack prize. Canada shot its self in the leg a very long time ago in that regard.
Brenda Brenda:
There is no border patrol in the West, but in the East there is. (I was checked when I drove from Czechy to Poland...).
As of sometime in December, the borders have disappeared, atleast with Germany and Poland. I'd imagine the other new states are the same way.
Congio Congio:
In a matter of fact it is the west's fault that Hitler invaded Poland, and that Communism was forced in central Europe. If France alone wanted to destroy Hitler, it had many chances before winter 1940, but no, the west had to wait until Germany gets prepared for war and skips the Maginot line through Benelux...
This has gotta be the joke of the day. France was never any match for the mighty Wehrmacht nor was their morale anywhere near the same level. Now if England had troops on French borders, history may have played out differently.
Congio Congio:
My attitude is that we are one Europe, and we share goals and fatalities. Western Europe was once selfish and didn't give shit about Central Europe. It was called WWII. East never ignored west though. And it isn't doing that now. Sure, Central Europe, will help, if it can, with the immigration problem.
Poland for one doesn't seem to keep its mouth shut. We'd love to ignore it, but we don't. How exactly does "Central Europe" help with the "immigration problem"? You've lost me on that.
Congio Congio:
Canada has so much land it could fit china's entire population. C'omon, the fact Canada is big, and awaits Colonization similar to XIX century California's is so obvious to me, that I don't see any need of further discussion on this topic.
It seems that's what Canada wants.. China's population. Most of British Columbia has been colonised to some degree yet. As Brenda and others have mentioned, Canada's land is not people-friendly. You can't have 500 million South Asians in Sub-arctic and Arctic climates. A lot of Canada's immigrants can't even deal with Montreal or Toronto let alone Iqaluit.
Congio Congio:
So do you prefer Canada to be USA 's bitch, or one of the deciding ones in the EU? Sorry to say, but with a population of 32 million in comparison with USA 's 300 million and Europe's over 400 million there is no fully independent Canada. Already today. Lets be realistic.
Switzerland is independent, completely surrounded by the EU. So is Norway.
Congio Congio:
Europe is loosing it's position in the world to China, India, Iran etc. If we don't unite there will be no money to be no money to be wasted. It'll all be in Shanghai, New Delhi and Al-Rijad. This is the truth.
Most of Europe IS united. It's called the European Union, isn't that what this thread is about?
SigPig SigPig:
First of all Greenland belongs to Denmark, so it makes sense that it belongs to the EU. However, last time I checked Canada is not part of Europe, so why join the EU? If the goal is greater trade and other economic benefits, why not just open more trade with things the way they are and put less emphasis on the US?
Greenland is not a member of the EU.
Congio Congio:
[...] As it was said in the video I posted, not by 2050 China will be a threat for us. We have 42 years still ;D
China is only a threat if we make it the threat. If we stop trusting them with Siemens prototypes (which are copied down to the screw), [the west] making trade with them digging ourselves into a hole and stop giving China the influence it doesn't deserve, it won't be a threat.
Does anybody realise the level of Chinese population which lives in total and utter poverty?
The same points above go to India.
[quote] That is running away. I am running away from Poland soon. [/qoute]
It sounds like you want to have the best of both worlds, and in the end having somebody else's hard work accomplish that. Why not stay in Poland and help your fellow countrymen build up your country? Surely Poland has a much older history and many more cultural inheritances than Canada?
Perhaps you may like to be part of rebuilding Polands infrastructure. As a German tourist, the roads and highways are a horror and downright scary.
The world is not black and white
It is not yes or no, Washington, Brussels or Beijing. It's about Canada's right to self determination. But Canada hasn't really had that for a long time anyways, the politicians and the media together make up peoples minds and Canadians were never asked if they wanted 300,000 third world immigrants per year nor would they probably ever be asked about a North American union.
danikyvor @ Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:21 am
Great post Andem! 
ShepherdsDog @ Fri Feb 29, 2008 4:42 am
Most of the Europeans who wanted to emigrate to Canada did so during the last century. Canadian multiculturalism was intended to be a blending of European cultures, not world cultures.
Congio @ Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:29 am
I don't want to be mean but I feel like a father explaining stuff to his kids... ;/
ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:
Most of the Europeans who wanted to emigrate to Canada did so during the last century. Canadian multiculturalism was intended to be a blending of European cultures, not world cultures.
Exactly.
Canada invites Chinese, Hindu and Muslims because there are not much Europeans willing to move Canada for the rest of their lives. Not as many Chinese etc...
Andem Andem:
Congio Congio:
Voila:
Cultural
- Canada could protect it's Franco-British heritage from Americanization.
Cultural
- Canada could protect it's Franco-British heritage from Americanization.
Canada doesn't have Franco-British culture. It has a culture based on the people who came to populate the land. It's changed a lot since then.
Ekhem. Language. Google Spahir-Whorf theory
80% of Canadians have Euro heritage
Andem Andem:
$1:
- Quebec and all other Francophones, as I know, would be more pleased with the EU than American Union
Of course they are. Didn't you know it's cool to be anti-American? Pfft.
Furthermore, Quebec has retained a little more of their European-rooted culture than the ROC has.
If it would please Quebec that is already 25% of Canada.
Andem Andem:
$1:
- Canada and Canadians could profit more from European culture.
Canada's already happy destroying what culture they have left. Last time I was in Toronto, mainstream Canadian culture was further marginalised by places such as Chinatown and Brampton.
And you think that is good?
I like the Multiculturalism. But Canada has two Mainstream cultures: English and French. Let's keep it. I don't feel like learning Mandarin or Punjabi
Andem Andem:
Other people replying to this thread have touched on this point. Canada would have no real voting power and would ultimately be giving up sovereignty to its natural resources.
Ekhem....
As I told: Canada can choose between :
a Union with the USA, where Canada would have nothing to say
a Union with Europe, where Canada would be important because no othe country tops it with land, resources, a most don't top it with population.
Union with US- Canad is it's bitch. Union with EU- Canada is Respected.
Andem Andem:
$1:
Economy
- Many services on the line Canada Europe would become cheaper. Students could have free education in Europe
- Many services on the line Canada Europe would become cheaper. Students could have free education in Europe
As a German taxpayer, I don't want to subsidise Canadians who want to study for free in Germany; not anymore than I want to subsidise Poland whos government is a real pain in the arse for us. Talk about ungreatful.
It works both way. You would subsidise Canadians in Germany, Canadians Germans in Canada
Poland ungreatful?
Andem Andem:
$1:
- There would be more immigrants of European descent.
Canada doesn't want immigrants of European descent. They want third worlders as slave-labourers to replace the current population.
Yes it does, but it can't have them. Not so many Euros want to move to Canada these days.
Every country wants immigrants of closer cultural background to it's own.
Andem Andem:
Congio Congio:
To gain Polish citizenship is very hard. Harder than Canadian.
Are you serious? Harder than Polish citizenship? A Canadian passport, sadly, is one notch up from a crackerjack prize. Canada shot its self in the leg a very long time ago in that regard.
Yes. The president himself must sign a new citizenship certificate
Andem Andem:
Brenda Brenda:
There is no border patrol in the West, but in the East there is. (I was checked when I drove from Czechy to Poland...).
As of sometime in December, the borders have disappeared, atleast with Germany and Poland. I'd imagine the other new states are the same way.
Now I will show your incompetence on political topics: you live in Europe and you don't even know which countries have no borders.
Andem Andem:
Congio Congio:
In a matter of fact it is the west's fault that Hitler invaded Poland, and that Communism was forced in central Europe. If France alone wanted to destroy Hitler, it had many chances before winter 1940, but no, the west had to wait until Germany gets prepared for war and skips the Maginot line through Benelux...
This has gotta be the joke of the day. France was never any match for the mighty Wehrmacht nor was their morale anywhere near the same level. Now if England had troops on French borders, history may have played out differently.
Well, Hitler in September 1939 sent all German troops to Poland. The French could have taken over Germany without one gun shoot.
Before 1936 Germany had almost no army due to Versailles treaty regulations after the WWI.
So yes, France itself could have done that.
Andem Andem:
Congio Congio:
My attitude is that we are one Europe, and we share goals and fatalities. Western Europe was once selfish and didn't give shit about Central Europe. It was called WWII. East never ignored west though. And it isn't doing that now. Sure, Central Europe, will help, if it can, with the immigration problem.
Poland for one doesn't seem to keep its mouth shut. We'd love to ignore it, but we don't. How exactly does "Central Europe" help with the "immigration problem"? You've lost me on that.
Mouth shut? So you are telling someone to shut up? Not nice. Chirac already did this and it wasn't good for him.
I said if it could it would. I don't know how. I am not an immigration officer..
Andem Andem:
Congio Congio:
Canada has so much land it could fit china's entire population. C'omon, the fact Canada is big, and awaits Colonization similar to XIX century California's is so obvious to me, that I don't see any need of further discussion on this topic.
It seems that's what Canada wants.. China's population. Most of British Columbia has been colonised to some degree yet. As Brenda and others have mentioned, Canada's land is not people-friendly. You can't have 500 million South Asians in Sub-arctic and Arctic climates. A lot of Canada's immigrants can't even deal with Montreal or Toronto let alone Iqaluit.
Canada has nothing to choose from than Chinas population. If Europeans wanted to come to Canada like the Chinese do, Canada would choose the Euros. But the Europeans don't want to, cause everything is going in a good ay in Europe. China still has communism and secret Police and other shit.
Andem Andem:
Congio Congio:
So do you prefer Canada to be USA 's bitch, or one of the deciding ones in the EU? Sorry to say, but with a population of 32 million in comparison with USA 's 300 million and Europe's over 400 million there is no fully independent Canada. Already today. Lets be realistic.
Switzerland is independent, completely surrounded by the EU. So is Norway.
I know.... Damn.
But some day they will enter the EU. They already have lots of agrements with Brussels.
Andem Andem:
Congio Congio:
Europe is loosing it's position in the world to China, India, Iran etc. If we don't unite there will be no money to be no money to be wasted. It'll all be in Shanghai, New Delhi and Al-Rijad. This is the truth.
Most of Europe IS united. It's called the European Union, isn't that what this thread is about?
Are you trying to pis me of.
Andem Andem:
Congio Congio:
[...] As it was said in the video I posted, not by 2050 China will be a threat for us. We have 42 years still ;D
China is only a threat if we make it the threat. If we stop trusting them with Siemens prototypes (which are copied down to the screw), [the west] making trade with them digging ourselves into a hole and stop giving China the influence it doesn't deserve, it won't be a threat.
Does anybody realise the level of Chinese population which lives in total and utter poverty?
The same points above go to India.
Poverty not for long. 30 years ago most of chinse were poor. Today most are middile class. See?
China will be a treat. As India will be. If we don't unite, they will take over the world. As the USA did after 1989.
Andem Andem:
$1:
That is running away. I am running away from Poland soon. [/qoute]
It sounds like you want to have the best of both worlds, and in the end having somebody else's hard work accomplish that. Why not stay in Poland and help your fellow countrymen build up your country? Surely Poland has a much older history and many more cultural inheritances than Canada?
Perhaps you may like to be part of rebuilding Polands infrastructure. As a German tourist, the roads and highways are a horror and downright scary.
It sounds like you want to have the best of both worlds, and in the end having somebody else's hard work accomplish that. Why not stay in Poland and help your fellow countrymen build up your country? Surely Poland has a much older history and many more cultural inheritances than Canada?
Perhaps you may like to be part of rebuilding Polands infrastructure. As a German tourist, the roads and highways are a horror and downright scary.
Because I am Canadian. From Ottawa. I lived in Poland but never forgot who I am. I learned French in a French school.
My parents wanted me to gain a little European vibe while I am a kid. And I truly believe Canada has a lot in Common with Europe.
Andem Andem:
It's about Canada's right to self determination. .
Exactly.
danikyvor @ Fri Feb 29, 2008 5:51 am
It seems to me that you want people to listen to your ideas Congio, but you look down on others' thoughts and opinions about this whole EU thing.
The fact of the matter is, and EVERYONE other than you knows it because we LIVE in Canada and know how it operates - Canada joining the EU is a pipe dream. A) it will NEVER happen and B) Canada will just be the "EU's Bitch" as opposed to the USA's.
I was rather amused to read your comment about having no interest in learning mandarin or punjabi. Too late. Hope you never end up in BC then, or in Ontario. Mandarin is already a language offered in many schools in BC, not sure about punjabi in others. Besides, what's wrong with having languages offered? That's one thing that sets us apart from the US - awareness of other cultures/countries.
Ah to be young with big ideas. Sorry for the sarcasm but this thread is repeating itself like a broken record.
Congio @ Fri Feb 29, 2008 7:01 am
dimoreien dimoreien:
this thread is repeating itself like a broken record.
I know.
dimoreien dimoreien:
Ah to be young with big ideas.
Hah,
Yup.
dimoreien dimoreien:
Sorry for the sarcasm but
No problem
dimoreien dimoreien:
It seems to me that you want people to listen to your ideas Congio, but you look down on others' thoughts and opinions about this whole EU thing.
I do listen. That is why I said that Canada shouldn't join now. But it will have a sort of bigger cooperation with Europe someday.
dimoreien dimoreien:
The fact of the matter is, and EVERYONE other than you knows it because we LIVE in Canada and know how it operates
Sad but true. That is why I am coming to Canada this summer.
dimoreien dimoreien:
- Canada joining the EU is a pipe dream.
So you say the USA only? Canada is to small to be an entity of it's own. Canada belongs to the west. The west divides into two parts: Europe and USA. With which Canada should strengthen it's ties?
dimoreien dimoreien:
A) it will NEVER happen and
Yes it will. Step by step. Joining the EU today is just a to big step for Canada. Unification and Globalisation will do it's job.
dimoreien dimoreien:
B) Canada will just be the "EU's Bitch" as opposed to the USA's.
The USA will do everything Canada wants it to do. Yeah...
The USA treat Canada as a minor, younger brother. The EU wouldn't.
dimoreien dimoreien:
I was rather amused to read your comment about having no interest in learning mandarin or punjabi. Too late. Hope you never end up in BC then, or in Ontario.
Well, I meant I don't want to be forced to learn it so that I could live normally in Canada. I meant I don't want them to be official languages in Canada soon.
But yeah, why not? I could take Mandarin classes some day. I have to finish my German classes first.
dimoreien dimoreien:
awareness of other cultures/countries.
I study cultural studies.
I know 5 languages.
I've visited most of Europe.
O, I am aware of other cultures and countries.
====== Read Huntington's clash of Civilizations.
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