Religion has no place in public school
Zipperfish @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:47 am
andyt andyt:
You saying Brock and Dayseed are presenting themselves as victims? Or victim's advocates I guess. Oh, how could I turn such a blind eye to discrimination by suggesting this shouldn't happen on school property during school hours, no matter if menstruation is involved.
I agree with you that it should not be allowed period. It's a public facility for public use. We've drawn the line with Christians as it should be drawn for all religions.
Heather Mallick, who raised the issue of the gender sepaartion, is a liberal-leftie type. She couldn't really go after the Muslims as they are already a "disadvantaged group" in PC speak. So she had to find an even more disadvantaged group (Muslim women) and approach the problem from there.
andyt @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:57 am
You mean Brock is parroting Heather Malik. Say it isn't so.
Zipperfish @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:05 pm
Well, "parroting" is kind of a pejorative term, but I suppose they agree that this is wrong, if possibly for different reasons. As do I. It's baloney. School should be religion-free, period. You give these people an inch and they'll take a mile.
Dayseed @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:02 pm
andyt andyt:
You saying Brock and Dayseed are presenting themselves as victims? Or victim's advocates I guess. Oh, how could I turn such a blind eye to discrimination by suggesting this shouldn't happen on school property during school hours, no matter if menstruation is involved.
Next up - orthodox Jews can't have sex with their wives while the wives are menstruating. So we'll accommodate them having sex in schools as long as they stop such a discriminatory practice.
Next up - orthodox Jews can't have sex with their wives while the wives are menstruating. So we'll accommodate them having sex in schools as long as they stop such a discriminatory practice.
Andy,
Remember when you crabbed for three pages about how you believed Eyebrock was misunderstanding you?
Shoe's on the other foot.
Here's my quote
$1:
The fact that girls were discriminated against, while horrible, only comes about because nobody said no to religion creeping into school at all. Why did nobody say anything?
See how that stems from the religion in schools bit? See how the discrimination is secondary to the fact that there's even a prayer session in a public school?
Knock off the shit like I'm complaining that some kids had to use .45 rounds in a shooting competition at a daycare.
Curtman @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:17 pm
andyt andyt:
Nope. What sort of tax breaks do they get?
I'm sure there are all sorts of human rights violations going on in religious groups. It would certainly be opening a can of worms to try to make them all reform those.
I'm sure there are all sorts of human rights violations going on in religious groups. It would certainly be opening a can of worms to try to make them all reform those.
CBC INDEPTH: THE HUTTERITES
$1:
The Hutterites are a Christian group who live according to a strict code based on the Ten Commandments and the teachings of Jesus Christ.
Hutterite-run firms don’t pay their workers wages or seek big profits. Competitors say it’s unfair.
$1:
Frustrated by a steady drift of metal roof and siding orders to Hutterite-owned competitors, building supply companies are pressuring the Manitoba government to take action, arguing the market is tilted in favour of Hutterite enterprises because colony members work for free, and because their firms are exempt from certain taxes.
The Hutterites are an Anabaptist sect whose adherents live communally, sharing resources and property on farming colonies that speckle the southern Prairies and parts of the U.S. plains. For the most part, they’ve coexisted peacefully with neighbours, but tensions began rising in the 1990s, when some colonies turned to commercial enterprises to help support their way of life, raising the unexpected question of whether communal living constitutes an unfair advantage in the marketplace.
...
They also face a reduced burden when it comes to taxes and fees levied on a per-employee basis, such as health premiums, post-secondary education taxes and workers’ compensation fees. “Every year they gain a bit more market share and a bigger customer base,” said Gino Coco, general sales manager for metal building products company Vicwest, in a recent interview with CBC Manitoba. “It takes away from companies such as ourselves who are operating under different circumstances, or different rules and regulations.”
The Hutterites are an Anabaptist sect whose adherents live communally, sharing resources and property on farming colonies that speckle the southern Prairies and parts of the U.S. plains. For the most part, they’ve coexisted peacefully with neighbours, but tensions began rising in the 1990s, when some colonies turned to commercial enterprises to help support their way of life, raising the unexpected question of whether communal living constitutes an unfair advantage in the marketplace.
...
They also face a reduced burden when it comes to taxes and fees levied on a per-employee basis, such as health premiums, post-secondary education taxes and workers’ compensation fees. “Every year they gain a bit more market share and a bigger customer base,” said Gino Coco, general sales manager for metal building products company Vicwest, in a recent interview with CBC Manitoba. “It takes away from companies such as ourselves who are operating under different circumstances, or different rules and regulations.”
Wikipedia: Hutterite
$1:
A basic tenet of Hutterian society has always been absolute pacifism, forbidding its members from taking part in military activities, taking orders, wearing a formal uniform (such as a soldier's or a police officer's) or contributing to war taxes. This has led to expulsion or persecution in the several lands in which they have lived.
...
Hutterite colonies are male-managed with women participating in traditional roles such as cooking, medical decisions, and selection and purchase of fabric for clothing.
...
The Secretary's wife sometimes holds the title of Schneider (from German "tailor") and thus she is in charge of clothes making and purchasing the colony's fabric requirements for making of all clothing.
...
Women and children hold no formal vote in decision-making power in a colony.
...
Hutterite colonies are male-managed with women participating in traditional roles such as cooking, medical decisions, and selection and purchase of fabric for clothing.
...
The Secretary's wife sometimes holds the title of Schneider (from German "tailor") and thus she is in charge of clothes making and purchasing the colony's fabric requirements for making of all clothing.
...
Women and children hold no formal vote in decision-making power in a colony.
They are allowed to play volleyball though evidently. A group of them took over our volleyball court a few weeks ago.
ShepherdsDog @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:53 pm
Mennonites and Hutterites make excellent neighbours and are usually the first people to lend a hand when needed...well Mennonites more so than Hutterites. My wife did a teaching stint on a Hutterite colony. The kids did their regular schooling, than they had their religious schooling in German. She used to bring home a lot of homemade baked goods. I remember the bread and butter tarts(actually more like small pies).
Zipperfish @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:57 pm
Hutterites stil inbreeding? Used to be a problem, I recall.
ShepherdsDog @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:34 pm
I'm sure there are a few colonies that have family trees that don't fork.
Brenda @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:38 pm
I'm sure there are families here in my neck of the woods, who are not Hutterites, who have a similar family tree...
Zipperfish @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 5:23 pm
Doukaboors?
Thanos @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 5:25 pm
Dukeofearls, actually. 
Brenda @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 5:26 pm
Nah, just regular families with a LOT of "cousins" 
Wada @ Thu Jul 14, 2011 5:28 pm
andyt @ Fri Jul 15, 2011 12:07 am
Dayseed Dayseed:
andyt andyt:
You saying Brock and Dayseed are presenting themselves as victims? Or victim's advocates I guess. Oh, how could I turn such a blind eye to discrimination by suggesting this shouldn't happen on school property during school hours, no matter if menstruation is involved.
Next up - orthodox Jews can't have sex with their wives while the wives are menstruating. So we'll accommodate them having sex in schools as long as they stop such a discriminatory practice.
Next up - orthodox Jews can't have sex with their wives while the wives are menstruating. So we'll accommodate them having sex in schools as long as they stop such a discriminatory practice.
Andy,
Remember when you crabbed for three pages about how you believed Eyebrock was misunderstanding you?
Shoe's on the other foot.
Here's my quote
$1:
The fact that girls were discriminated against, while horrible, only comes about because nobody said no to religion creeping into school at all. Why did nobody say anything?
See how that stems from the religion in schools bit? See how the discrimination is secondary to the fact that there's even a prayer session in a public school?
Knock off the shit like I'm complaining that some kids had to use .45 rounds in a shooting competition at a daycare.
Re: underlined part - it was a little more than that. Claiming that when I quoted him I was actually quoting myself was just pure bullshit.
Alright, when you've pulled out that particular part of your quote, we seem to be on the same page. I just don't get why menstruation or sex segregation is relevant here, when the issue is holding religious services in school. They could be the most egalitarian group in history, and it would still be wrong.
I don't get your last line at all.