Canada Kicks Ass
The international peace movement, what purpose does it serve

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DerbyX @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:11 pm

BartSimpson BartSimpson:
DerbyX DerbyX:

He was a devout christian. Get over it. :roll:


Then please show me any evidence whatsoever that he owned a Bible or ever quoted from Scripture, as would a devout Christian. :idea:


Also, Derby, your persecution of Christianity has been an ongoing theme on this forum the entire time I've been here.

Get over it.


Ahhh the myth that I "persecute" you poor maligned christians. :roll:

Hitler quoting the bible:
$1:
"Sooner will a camel pass through a needle's eye than a great man be 'discovered' by an election"6 (Hitler was fond of paraphrasing the Bible (Mark 10:25 in this case), and he does this many, many times elsewhere in the book).


You have absolutely no problem with condemming mohammed, any and all muslims, all communists, virtually all lefties and almost all leftist thinking yet have the gall to accuse somebody else of persecuting.

People who hold the false belief that Hitler was anything other then a devout christian in his beliefs need to be educated.

I mearly serve as the tutor.

BTW, you want me to stop "persecuting" christians/christianity?

You start. I want you to refrain from saying anything bad about islam & anything considered "leftists".

   



BartSimpson @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:19 pm

DerbyX DerbyX:
They (the Nazis) outlawed all free thought organizations.


Because (and I qualify this comment) at that time atheist organisations were typically sponsored and populated by Communists. The Nazis had a big old jones for the Reds and they went after any group that had any Communist affiliations. I don't think they necessarily gave a rip about individual atheists so much as their organisations which were being supported and guided by the ComIntern - something that the Russians have made public with the end of the USSR.

   



BartSimpson @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:20 pm

DerbyX DerbyX:
You start. I want you to refrain from saying anything bad about islam & anything considered "leftists".


You want me to lie?

   



sandorski @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:20 pm

BartSimpson BartSimpson:
sandorski sandorski:
I have answered the question, but if you want more detail I'll give it.

Approx 10% of Americans identify themselves as Agnostic/Atheist. Does this mean that Americans are Agnostic/Atheist as a whole?

More specifically concerning Che Guevera(sp): I put to you to consider this: Not everyone who considers Che as a "hero" does so because of his Communist Idealism. They often do so out of admiration for his support of the Working Man. Others do so because they don't really know who he is, just that others with common goals(this case Peace) identify with him.

A quick Google finds this page with many links: Peace Orgs, I haven't bothered to check any of the links, but I'll bet that very few have any links to Communism, Che Guevera, or other [insert nonsensical generalization here]. In fact, I'll bet that there are more links to Christian Orgs(thus negating my previous example link) than there are to Communist Orgs. So is the Peace Movement now Christian?


Che Guevara was hardly a peace activist and anyone who thinks of him as one is an ass. Period.


I agree.

   



sandorski @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:28 pm

Durandal Durandal:
sandorski sandorski:
Approx 10% of Americans identify themselves as Agnostic/Atheist. Does this mean that Americans are Agnostic/Atheist as a whole?


:roll:

No, dear.

You forgot http://www.discoverthenetwork.org/ that shows the links between close to all (if not all) the "pro-peace" organisation/unions/personalities/etc that clearly demonstrates that the scream for peace of the left serves other purposes than peace.

$1:
More specifically concerning Che Guevera: I put to you to consider this: Not everyone who considers Che as a "hero" does so because of his Communist Idealism. They often do so out of admiration for his support of the Working Man.


Err... his support for the working man... working man exploited by our system of free entreprise... working man unhappy... working men must unite... working men must throw out the evil conservatives... VIVA LA REVOLUTION !!!

Hey, I just typed "viva la revolution" on Yahoo to see how we write "revolution" in Spanish, and vlam ! I en up on this site : http://perso.orange.fr/do/

I enter the site, and vlam ! what do I see ?

> Conspiration histories about terrorists attacks.

> Anti-Israel "pacifism" + links to Hozbollah web sites, Al-Manar TV.

> Anti-US/UK pacifism on Iraq + links to terrorist organisations operation in Iraq.

$1:
Others do so because they don't really know who he is


That sounds like usefull idiots, doesn't it ?

$1:
just that others with common goals(this case Peace) identify with him.


But Che has nothing to do with peace, he was a warrior !

Image

So their goal is, just as I said, not peace, but socialism. You are arguing in my favor.

$1:
A quick Google finds this page with many links: Peace Orgs, I haven't bothered to check any of the links, but I'll bet that very few have any links to Communism, Che Guevera.


I don't care about the little websites that you "haven't bothered to check any of the links".

Tell me, sandorski, what organisations organises the most and the biggest "anti-war" marches in the West ? And what alternative they present for the current situation, where nasty Christian capitalists have taken controll of mother earth ?

Socialists is the 1st answer, socialism is the 2nd. :wink:

In fact, I'll bet that there are more links to Christian Orgs(thus negating my previous example link) than there are to Communist Orgs.

$1:
So is the Peace Movement now Christian?


It sure has has lots of mazoshist who-would-Jesus-bomb Chistians. Many Christian apologists are pacifists ; the catho church itself has became a head-in-sand anti-war organisation (but for reasons of intelectual comfort, not for the sole objective to promote the leftist dogmas).

The only problem with this argument is that anti-conservative values (therefor anti-Christian) is an integral part of the far-left rallying screams.


Well, there's your problem right there. You're confusing Politics and Religion. Always bad news.

You have failed to grasp anything I've said, just went on another tirade about Socialism. Take your time to try and Hear what others are saying and quit Assuming what they are saying.

   



DerbyX @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 2:31 pm

BartSimpson BartSimpson:
DerbyX DerbyX:
You start. I want you to refrain from saying anything bad about islam & anything considered "leftists".


You want me to lie?


No. I doubt you want me to either.

It pisses you off when I attack christians/christianity because you are one. It pisses you off when people attack the US because you are an American.

The same goes for me when you attack the various aspects of my political/social belief systems.

That shouldn't be surprising. Just as you said its not personal when you attack leftist viewpoints its not personal when I attack the very wrong belief that Hitler was anything but a christian.

I'm not making a blanket statement implicating all christians in Hitlers actions anymore then I am by pointing out that Jim Jones was a christian, David Koresh, that westboro guy and his brainwashed family, ........

The biggest reason that christians cannot stomach this unpleasant fact is generally because they themselves use the blanket tactic themselves, like blaming all of Atheism and its concepts with regards to Stalin.

Facts are Facts. I'm an Atheist and a Canadian. You are a christian and an American.

Hitler was a christian and a German (or Austrian if you get technical).

   



BartSimpson @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:12 pm

DerbyX DerbyX:
It pisses you off when I attack christians/christianity because you are one. It pisses you off when people attack the US because you are an American.


No, it pisses me off when people attack Christianity & the USA with unfounded half-truths, misconceptions, and outright lies. For the record, I've often noted the shortcomings of both on this very site when the accusations are factual.

DerbyX DerbyX:
The same goes for me when you attack the various aspects of my political/social belief systems.


I've never criticised you for your atheism. Never. I've also never criticised atheism itself although I have made cheeky little comments from time to time - but all in fun, of course.

As to the leftism, yep. I am unabashedly opposed to just about anything on the political left as leftism invariably lends itself to authoritarianism. Non-authoritarian and voluntary leftism, including voluntary communism (small 'c') has never been a problem for me. If you want to do these things then have at it. It's when someone points a rifle at me and expects me to participate is when I get upset - this includes the use of government force to relieve me of my money in the form of taxes to fund socialism.

DerbyX DerbyX:
That shouldn't be surprising. Just as you said its not personal when you attack leftist viewpoints its not personal when I attack the very wrong belief that Hitler was anything but a christian.


In the context in which you continually harp on this it isn't merely that you're saying that Hitler was a Christian, no, you clearly insinuate that you BLAME Christianity for Hitler.

DerbyX DerbyX:
I'm not making a blanket statement implicating all christians in Hitlers actions anymore then I am by pointing out that Jim Jones was a christian, David Koresh, that westboro guy and his brainwashed family, ........


The disclaimer was a waste of time and it would not need to be said if it were self-evident, which it is not. You never go off about how Jones, Koresh, or etc. were/are Christians, nope, you always revist Herr Stickelgruber. Again, this is to BLAME Christianity for Hitler.

DerbyX DerbyX:
The biggest reason that christians cannot stomach this unpleasant fact is generally because they themselves use the blanket tactic themselves, like blaming all of Atheism and its concepts with regards to Stalin.


No, the reason we don't like it is because you're hanging Hitler and his atrocities on Christianity.

DerbyX DerbyX:
Facts are Facts. I'm an Atheist and a Canadian. You are a christian and an American.

Hitler was a christian and a German (or Austrian if you get technical).


The last thing I notice here is that you capitalise 'Atheist' as if it were a religious faith while you deliberately demonstrate your contempt for Christianity and Christ by consistently refusing to capitalise what are, grammatically speaking, proper nouns.

Again, your purpose here is not to educate but to insult.

   



BartSimpson @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:27 pm

Oliver North Oliver North:
When toilet paper is a luxury, you have achieved communism.


I've always liked this comment.

   



Scrappy @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:34 pm

BartSimpson BartSimpson:
DerbyX DerbyX:
You start. I want you to refrain from saying anything bad about islam & anything considered "leftists".


You want me to lie?


Yes that is the general Idea of the left/left christian bashing smelly crowd. You see Bart the socialist in Canada will never achieve their lofty goals of a Socialist Nervana without an influx of immigrants and they like the Muslims because they share the same ethos and indoctorine. The socialist fools think they can control the Radical savages, I guess they haven't read much on Lebanon. A predominantly Christian peaceful country takes in Muslim Immigrants and lo and behold look at that poor country today. Socialism is a desease, like VD only the hardcore believers are mad at the onset of the desease not at the palative end stage.

   



DerbyX @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:47 pm

$1:
No, it pisses me off when people attack Christianity & the USA with unfounded half-truths, misconceptions, and outright lies. For the record, I've often noted the shortcomings of both on this very site when the accusations are factual.


Only I don't use unfounded half-truths, misconceptions, or outright lies.

I leave that to the right-wing pundits.

$1:
I've never criticised you for your atheism. Never. I've also never criticised atheism itself although I have made cheeky little comments from time to time - but all in fun, of course.


I've never critized you for your beliefs and point of fact is that you have criticized Atheism before. You certainly hold nothing back in attacking leftist thinking.

$1:
As to the leftism, yep. I am unabashedly opposed to just about anything on the political left as leftism invariably lends itself to authoritarianism. Non-authoritarian and voluntary leftism, including voluntary communism (small 'c') has never been a problem for me. If you want to do these things then have at it. It's when someone points a rifle at me and expects me to participate is when I get upset - this includes the use of government force to relieve me of my money in the form of taxes to fund socialism.


Case in point. Why should I be attacked by you because I believe that a life of religion leads to ignorance, denial, immorality in the guise of morality, hate, fear, war, and a ton of other bad things.

You accuse "leftist" politics of stealing your money to fund social programs yet never seem to grasp the reality that they can lay claim that far more money is stolen from them to fund right-wing aganda's like massive military spending.

In your eyes it only flows one way right?

$1:
In the context in which you continually harp on this it isn't merely that you're saying that Hitler was a Christian, no, you clearly insinuate that you BLAME Christianity for Hitler.


:roll: Yet again you fail to grasp the realities. I don't blame christianity for Hitler, I blame his anti-semetism for it. I blame it for his religious beliefs because where else should that fall? Political beliefs are another matter entirely.

Of course you ignore the fact that you blame islam for all their evil and "leftist thinking" for anythin bad you perceive as being bad.

Its perfectly OK when you do it thought because you are justified eh?

$1:
The disclaimer was a waste of time and it would not need to be said if it were self-evident, which it is not. You never go off about how Jones, Koresh, or etc. were/are Christians, nope, you always revist Herr Stickelgruber. Again, this is to BLAME Christianity for Hitler.


Thats because people like you are trying desperately and dishonestly to claim that "herr Stickelgruber" wasn't a christian when in fact he was.

Whens the last time somebody claimed the others weren't?

Of course you have no problem blaming "the left" for every conceivable ill in society because you and you alone are entitled to that priveledge.

$1:
No, the reason we don't like it is because you're hanging Hitler and his atrocities on Christianity.


Yet you have no problem hanging all of islams atrocities directly on it.

Hitler's hatred of the jews came directly from his religious upbringing. Get over it.

$1:
The last thing I notice here is that you capitalise 'Atheist' as if it were a religious faith while you deliberately demonstrate your contempt for Christianity and Christ by consistently refusing to capitalise what are, grammatically speaking, proper nouns.


Too fucking bad. You make no effort to conceal your contempt for the beliefs of others be they political or religious and I don't see you capitalizing Atheism though you do it for christianity.

Too bad. You continually hold the opinion that its OK when you do something but not OK when others respond in kind.

Suck it up. On yer bike. :roll:

   



BartSimpson @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:49 pm

Scrappy Scrappy:
Yes that is the general Idea of the left/left christian bashing smelly crowd.


I see you've observed the leftwing's ongoing boycott of deodorant and other personal hygiene products. :lol:

   



BartSimpson @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:52 pm

DerbyX DerbyX:
....


Image

   



DerbyX @ Wed Jun 13, 2007 3:59 pm

BartSimpson BartSimpson:
DerbyX DerbyX:
....


Image


:roll:

   



Durandal @ Thu Jun 14, 2007 12:15 pm

DerbyX DerbyX:
You seem to have ignored these:

[BLA BLA BLA DELETED]



Exactly, he both blasted the christian faith and putted it on a pedestal when it fitted him.

We can come up with quotes of both.

$1:
"Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."


He visibly didn't spent enough time reading the Holy Bible and too much time writing his Mein Kampf and phantasming about the evolution of the human race.

Here's what it looks like when christians really fallow the Christian faith :

http://www.jerusalemonline.com/specials12.asp

http://www.factsandlogic.org/hotline_ar ... 41107.html

$1:
In fact you can quote just about all of Mein Kampf as christian fundementalism beliefs


Pfffff... n'importe quoi !

And as demonstrated in one of the links I have provided, we CAN quote just about all of Mein Kampf as Islamic fundementalism beliefs. :roll:

$1:
You are ignoring the fact that The Nazis made it illegal to speak out against religion or the Christian churches. They closed all secular schools, and introduced school prayer and religious instruction in all educational institutions. They outlawed all free thought organizations.


He completely hijacked Christianity in all the territories he took controll of. Actually, Christianity was already hijacked in most of the places that he conquered, but that is an other issue...

$1:
Hardly the actions of an Atheist or Pagan.


And the slauther of 200 000 Orthodox Christians in the Balkans by the 60 000 Muslim SS's under the command of Hitler's Mutfi was hardly the actions of a Christian ! [bash]

$1:
Of course you are a desperate pathetic fool trying to say that Hitler was a muslims?????


No, I am just demonstrating that in the WW2 period, the link between Islam and Nazism was at least as strong as the link between Christianity [and Christianity is NOT Christianism !!!] and Nazism.

Thus the argument about Hitler and Christianity is bogus.

$1:
Patrick was right about you.


:mrgreen:

$1:
Hitler believed in Heaven, Hell, a supreme being who created the universe, Jesus Christ, life after death, special creation, original sin, expulsion from paradise, and divine judgement.

Sounds like a christian to me.


Just for your very personal information, Muslims all believe in Heaven, Hell, a supreme being who created the universe, Jesus Christ, life after death, special creation, original sin, expulsion from paradise, and divine judgement. :wink:

$1:
He isn't worshipping mohammed.


Here's more about Islam and Nazism...

THE DOCUMANTATION CENTER ABOUT NAZISLAMISM

THE NAZI ROOTS OF THE MODERN JIHAD

THE HISTORICAL COLLABORATION OF NAZIS WITH MUSLIMS/ARABS

ISLAMIC FASCISM, ISRAEL, AND THE AMERICAN LEFT

AND MUCH MORE HERE : ISLAMO-NAZISME


Apart from it's numerous links with National-Socialism, Islam...

> does not recocnizes Jesus as the son of God ;

> says that Jesus was not crucified ;

> says that Jesus did not rise from the dead and ascend to heaven in front of 500 + persons ;

> says that all Christians must be killed, converted, or submitted.

Yet, Hitler didn't mind praising Islam, and even becoming good friends with Muslims. What a devout Christian.

$1:
3) Lies: By your own logic he could have lied about all his so-called muslim beliefs also.


Of course ; he was a maniac, he lied about everything and used all the things he lied about to pursue his crazy dreams.

$1:
Your argument fails its own logic.


Re.

$1:
Evolution. You creationists have been trying to ascribe racism to evolution ever since its inception by using the worst strawman tactics imaginable.

Evolution & White Supremacy


LOL

You evolutionists have been trying to ascribe racism to Christianity ever since the inception of Darwinism by using the worst strawman tactics imaginable. 8)

And thanks for posting a link that comfirms what I said. :wink: Here's a similar one...

Evolutionism and Catastrophism (Fascism, Stupidity...)

$1:
Next you tie Atheism to communism but unfortunately for you is simply a "guilt-by-association" fallacy.


Then we can say the same with Christianity, dummy.

:arrow: Your argument fails its own logic.

$1:
Stalin didn't kill because of his Atheism.


As much as Hitler didn't kill because of his so-called "Christianism" then.

:arrow: Your argument fails its own logic.

$1:
politics ... The Nazi's ... killed and persecuted those that spoke out against them and threatened their regimes ... He put priests into concentration camps? So what. They were put there for political reasons and not religious reasons.


I'm sorry, you yourself has learned me that Hitler believed that Jesus was an Aryan (+ all sorts of other stupidities), so all Chruches that felt under Nazi controll faced 2 choices :

> Submit to the National-Sosialist TOTAL deconstruction of Judeo-Christian beleifs, wait until liberation, and hope that it would not come too late for the Church.

> Continue in the way of the true [or at least more true than Hitler's distorted version] christian faith, and protest against Hitler's crimes.

The three fisrst links I have provided on this dabate demonstrate very well what hapened when we chose the 2nd option. Here they are, just to refresh your memory :

What about Hitler, wasn't he a Christian ?

Pie XII et les Juifs

Le silence de Pie XII


The priests were in concentration camps there for RELIGIOUS reasons. Get over it.

$1:
Hitler was a christian, of that there is nothing to disprove this fact.


You certainly haven't watched both documentaries that I have posted, or assimilated in your mind the things he said in the orange quote I have posted.

PDT_Armataz_01_05

$1:
Evolution has nothing to do with so-called "social Darwinism" or any mindless racists agenda's based on a poor understanding of its concepts. Evolution is simply an explanation to an observation as is the basis of all good science.


Sorry to have hurted your Mother Earth godless cult. :lol:

   



Durandal @ Thu Jun 14, 2007 12:36 pm

sandorski sandorski:
Well, there's your problem right there. You're confusing Politics and Religion. Always bad news.

You have failed to grasp anything I've said, just went on another tirade about Socialism. Take your time to try and Hear what others are saying and quit Assuming what they are saying.


Apart from that, you can't argue over the well-established fact that the prime movers behind the the "anti-war" crowd are far-left nebulous organisations and that they have other goals than "peace" .

Just go to the Protest Warrior web site and watch their videos, you will see people "marching for peace" agressing counter-protesters (+ being caught on tape, then confronted with it, then running away) and other people "marching for peace" admitting that they really march FOR A SOCIALIST WORLD.

The " stop the war now! [protest] " baby-cry is a coded message that means "Viva la Revolution!".

   



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