Should Canada become a member of the EU?

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Arctic_Menace @ Tue Feb 26, 2008 9:53 pm

$1:

The problem in Northern Ireland aren't new EU citizens, but Pakistanis and Hindus that don't want to assimilate. The Irish prefer closer cultural Polish or Lithuanian workers that Muslims and Hindus.

And you know this how? Did everyone in Northern Ireland call you up and tell you exactly how they feel about the subject?

I smell bigotry...

$1:

If Canada doesn't join the EU it will be a fact. Sooner or latter.

Well we're damned if we do, adn we're damned if we don't. Either join America and lose our independence, or join the EU and lose our independence...

Hmm, not a lot of good options there...

$1:

Anyway would the decisions of the EU be so different from Canada's goals?

Case in point, the shitstorms that are brewing in Britain and France. Oh, and let's not forget those fantastic fires in Southern France a couple years ago...

Also, the EU's goals right now seem to be:

- Suck up to China

- throw more money into the black pits called Eastern and Southern Europe

Canada's goals:

- Deal with Afghanistan

- Deal with Quebec

- Deal with Alberta

- Free trade with South Korea

$1:

No such thing like this exists. There is no EU Police.

Yes, we know that. Bacardi was making what's called a "euphimism".

$1:

It's not stupid. Don't you see any positive in the idea?

Yes, it is stupid and no, there is no positive. There's a reason why Brenda left the Netherlands...

$1:

or Canada will rule Brussels

If Britain and France and Germany together can't rule Brussels, then what snowball's chance in hell does Canada have of ruling Brussels? You're delusional.

And about the whole "Brenda against Eastern Europeans" thing, She is right. Western Europeans(France, Germany, Italy, Britain, etc.) hate the EU because their money pays for the benefits of Eastern Europeans such as yourself...

$1:

And what would they do? Invade?

You seem to miss the point. If we were part fo the EU, we have to adopt the economic policies of the EU, which means that our resources will be put into the commonpool of the rest of Europe's resources. In other words, instead of America taking our oil, it's now all of Europe...

$1:

And by joining it would.

No, it would not.

$1:

Canada as being friend of France and the UK would have a strong position. Even stronger thanks to it's natural resources!

You have no understanding of global politics, do you? :roll:

Being a friend of someone does not mean that you have a strong position. Canada is a friend of the USA, and our position is definately not strong, even though we're supposedly the "best of friends"...

commanderkai @ Tue Feb 26, 2008 9:54 pm

Congio Congio:

commanderkai commanderkai:

We're not European...so no

You just wrote that in an European language, our head of state is European, our politics are European, our life style in many aspects is European.

I don't want the Queen to be our head of state, and our politics is Canadian, we just based it off the Parliamentary system.

Arctic_Menace @ Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:03 pm

$1:

The reason Poland is bad the way it is, is because of Hitler's invasion of 1939 and 50 years of Communism, what was speared for Holland. World War 2 in Holland was a farce in comparison with Polands experiences.

I call bullshit on that one. Germany, being the instigator of World War II, had their economy dismantled, their military destroyed, their cities destroyed, and almost an entire generation of men dead. On top of that, Eastern Germany was part of the Soviet Iron Curtain for the same amount of time as Poland, roughly.

And hey, Germany is a strong and powerful country today, whereas Poland...Not so much...

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Congio Congio:

World War 2 in Holland was a farce in comparison with Polands experiences.

Yeah, who gives a crap about Amsterdam & Rotterdam being leveled after Holland surrendered to the Germans?

Yep, those Hollanders had it easy. :roll:

Thanos @ Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:18 pm

Real Canadians don't seem to be too comfortable with a yellow streak painted on our backs so, no, there's no way we should belong to the EU.

Arctic_Menace @ Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:27 pm

$1:

What? So you speak chinese, and Quebec is Indian. Our head of state is Japanese.
I didn't know...

Swing and a miss, dude.

Values has nothing to do with language. Well, except in Quebec.

When I say values, I mean the EU's values in terms of politics, economics, societal issues, etc. Language does not enter into it.

$1:

Ehhh... China? Islam?

What?

$1:

Canada anyway has to protect it's identity in comparison with the USA. Joining the EU would do that. for sure.

No, it would not.

$1:

I know, but NATO is much more important. NORAD is just sky observance.

Wow, you're a dumbass.

NORAD = North American Aerospace Defense Command. Key word in there is "Defense" as in, military. NORAD is where Canada and America's forces get together and cooperate. In other words, it's almost exactly the same as NATO, only we solely use planes. It's not sky observance, it's active sovereignty enforcement for Canada and America respectively. It is still a cooperative military alliance. Also, there are many training exercises where Canadians and Americans are present training side by side to foster a little thing called "interoperability".

$1:

I meant why are the USA and Canada in NATO?

Because Canada and the USA have vast swaths of our borders bordering the North Atlantic. :roll:

North Atlantic Treaty.

North Atlantic.

As in any country that has territory touching the North Atlantic or any adjoining seas would logically be part of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization.

Unfortunately, exceptions had been made in NATO to include Turkey and many Eastern European nations.

$1:

I know. So why isn't china or india in it? Culture?

Gee, I dunno. Maybe it's because of that fact that India and China are no where fucking near the goddamn North Atlantic? :roll:

$1:

Belgian bureaucrats helped change the post communist shit in something quite nice.

At the expense of western Europe...

$1:

Either one or another will happen some day.

Uh, no. Canada joining the EU will never happen. I will bet money on that. Canada "joining" America however...quite possibly...

Joe_Stalin @ Tue Feb 26, 2008 10:34 pm

Cong.

What part of "Shove the EU up your arse" do you not understand?
[bash]

Wally_Sconce @ Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:08 pm

Any canadian company with a CE stamp can sell their product in the EU, what would be gained by joining the EU?

Congio @ Wed Feb 27, 2008 3:35 am

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

- Better, bigger transatlantic trade

Not really...

Even if we were part of the EU, there would still be mad tariffs for anything crossing the Atlantic...

Think so? I am not sure

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

- Cultural Exchange (Quebec-France, Belgium; English Canada-United Kingdom)

Fair enough, were it not for one obvious flaw about this...

THERE ARE ALREADY INTERNATIONAL EXCHANGE/WORK ABROAD PROGRAMS AVAILABLE. YOU DON'T NEED TO BE PART OF THE EU TO ENJOY A GOOD OL' CULTURAL EXCHANGE...

I know. But it would increase much more. For the benefit of both.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

- Separation from the USA. Canada would be seen more idependent than before.

Wrong. We would be seen as nothing more than Belgium's bitch. Regardless of what you think, Canada will be seen as being subservient to another political power/entity. Whether it's America, the EU, China or Sealand, we would be subservient to someone else. Period.

You are wrong. It would give a message to the world: Canada isn't USA bitch. We decide on our own what and with whom we what to do things.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

Canada would play a very important role in Europe, becose of it's size, power and two cultures that could influence UK and France

Wow, you're an idiot.

Fuck you.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

First of all, Canada, both geographically and hsitorically has never been a part of Europe. Our only involvement was in the two world wars, which was when we still subservient to Britain to a fair degree.

Congratulation on your geography knowledge. Gues what? I know Canada is in North America! An so what?

Canada would have took part in WWII and WWI any way. As the US did.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

This brings me to my second point. England and France still see themselves as superior to Canada. There is no way that they would ever be influenced by us. For God's sake dude, they influenced us!

No they won't. Canada is the one with potential: land oil immigration. Now they don't need us that much, but latter?

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

Third point. Canada's power? Dude, Britain and France are permanent members of the UN security council and for many reasons. Namely the fact that they have larger and more impressive militaries than Canada. Oh, and they have nuclear weapons.

Canada has potential to be a power. 2 world largest land mass, oil, dimonds, gold. We invaite the most immigrants yearly out of all countries. Canada some day might be a Power.

Canada could afford already a Nuke.

As for now we don't need a bigger army. Our soldiers are one of the best in the world.

$1:

-Many other

Um, such as? If there are so many other reasons, why don't you list them all?[/quote]

Voila:

Cultural
- Canada could protect it's Franco-British heritage from Americanization.
- Quebec and all other Francophones, as I know, would be more pleased with the EU than American Union
- Canada and Canadians could profit more from European culture.

Politicaly
- Canada by choosing Europe would give a message: We decided on our own that we want to be with Europe, not the US
- Canada thanks to it's potential would be an important member of the EU
- Canada would gain European and international respect thanks to the role it could play.

Economy
- Many services on the line Canada Europe would become cheaper. Students could have free education in Europe
- Canada could be more independent economically from the US by having a bigger trade with the US
- There would be more immigrants of European descent.

and other that I just can't remind myself now

Congio @ Wed Feb 27, 2008 3:43 am

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Congio Congio:

World War 2 in Holland was a farce in comparison with Polands experiences.

Yeah, who gives a crap about Amsterdam & Rotterdam being leveled after Holland surrendered to the Germans?

Yep, those Hollanders had it easy. :roll:

Fuck you 2 time!

But it was the Germans who did the holocaust, who killed inocent people on the streets, Tortured people by pulling of their finger nails, by burning people alive.

And what happened? They got the Marshall plan and Poland didn't.

Most of Germany was capitalist. After the merger West Germany put a lot of money in Est Germany. And what? They have shit as here. But Poland did everything on its own.

Congio @ Wed Feb 27, 2008 3:46 am

Aging_Redneck Aging_Redneck:

Any canadian company with a CE stamp can sell their product in the EU, what would be gained by joining the EU?

None.

Give me good reasons why not?

Culture is in favour

Politics are rather in favour

Economy I am not sure if they are in favour

If you prefer to be americanized, fine. I want Canada to be strong and independent. That is why it should somehow cut of from US. Just a bit.

Congio @ Wed Feb 27, 2008 3:58 am

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

What? So you speak chinese, and Quebec is Indian. Our head of state is Japanese.
I didn't know...

You are a smart ass, arn't you?

I study Cultural Studies in one of the best Universities in Central Europe. and as I know, language does have an impact on culture. check this
out:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sapir-Whorf_hypothesis

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

Ehhh... China? Islam?

What?

Canada has closer links with Europe than China or Muslim countries. Europe and the USA are Canada natural allies, cause we are all similar.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

Canada anyway has to protect it's identity in comparison with the USA. Joining the EU would do that. for sure.

No, it would not.

Yes it would. Canada by joining the EU would somehow return the the traditional European values it shares with the UK and France. It would weaken the Americanization of our Country preventing it from becoming a part of the US.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

I know, but NATO is much more important. NORAD is just sky observance.

Wow, you're a dumbass.

So are you.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

NORAD = North American Aerospace Defense Command. Key word in there is "Defense" as in, military. NORAD is where Canada and America's forces get together and cooperate. In other words, it's almost exactly the same as NATO, only we solely use planes. It's not sky observance, it's active sovereignty enforcement for Canada and America respectively. It is still a cooperative military alliance. Also, there are many training exercises where Canadians and Americans are present training side by side to foster a little thing called "interoperability".

Aerospace?

But NATO is much moer important. Never heard of NORAD operations in Afghanistan.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

I meant why are the USA and Canada in NATO?

Because Canada and the USA have vast swaths of our borders bordering the North Atlantic. :roll:

$1:

I know. So why isn't china or india in it? Culture?

Gee, I dunno. Maybe it's because of that fact that India and China are no where fucking near the goddamn North Atlantic? :roll:

But why North Atlantic? You don't realy gett it that Europe is in the North Atlantic?

In you logic, we could make an alliance with china and call in North Pacific and everything would be ok?

Go back to school.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

Belgian bureaucrats helped change the post communist shit in something quite nice.

At the expense of western Europe...

Some how yes. But not that much. This country is doing a fine job by itself. Hey, Poland is in the EU only since 2004, and the difference between Poland 1986 and 2004 is enormous. There was no 'help' in that period.

Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

$1:

Either one or another will happen some day.

Uh, no. Canada joining the EU will never happen. I will bet money on that. Canada "joining" America however...quite possibly...

[/quote]

As I said before: Unification.

I know that some day, North America, Europe and Australia will creat an ALiance, called Western Alliance, or Wester Union, what ever.

I would like Canada to be an independent nation at the moment. But everything seems it will be part of the US.

I am not pessimistic. I am realistic.

huncutka @ Wed Feb 27, 2008 4:04 am

Aging_Redneck Aging_Redneck:

Any canadian company with a CE stamp can sell their product in the EU, what would be gained by joining the EU?

Canada would gain nothing according to me. Eu would gain much. They are the countries in him. I am European. I dare to join the discussion about it because of that.

Congio @ Wed Feb 27, 2008 4:14 am

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=itR0-I9idXk

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=XUhBB3FgslI

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=BzTJYdX9t ... re=related

Congio @ Wed Feb 27, 2008 4:28 am

OK, I think it is time finish this discussion. For a while.

I never said that I am for Canada joining the EU. I didn't vote.

All I said is that it is always an option. I can agree that it might be to soon for such a thing. I think that we might deal with this again in 20-30 years.

As for now the pools show 30% for yes, and 70%. What will be in 10 years? We will see.

As for now, lets just be happy that Canada is what it is: The best country in the world.

EDIT:
I'll ad one more thing. Scandinavia.

Canada is ranked the best, next to Norway and Sweden.

Norway is not in the EU, Sweden is.

Norway, and Switzerland, and two countries that could join at any moment. Some day they will. When I don't know.
Canada won't join the EU before them, that is sure.

stemmer @ Wed Feb 27, 2008 9:43 am

The direction of Europe is not the direction I want Canada to go...

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